High priority:

- Add new updates and hotfixes.
- Replace modified EXPLORER.EXE and SHELL32.DLL files with patchers and make optional Windows 2000 look.
- Better uninstallation support with batch files.
- Optional fix for IE 6.0 SP1 file deletion problem with IE 5.5 SP2 files.
- Install "MaxFileCache" fix on only 512+ MB of RAM systems.
- Petr's UPDATE.SYS work.
- 137 GB HDD limitation fix [with FDISK + FORMAT tools].

Low priority:

- Tweak: Change the Number of Simultaneous Connections.
- Add IPROP.DLL from DCOM98 [?].
- Add Q816093 MS Java VM update [5 MB!].
- Language checking for non-English systems.
- Checking of free HDD space.
- Add QFECHECK info.

They are only ideas, they are NOT certain features of the next version now.

Maybe to add version check as suggested by eGo®Z on RU-BOARD half year ago for nusb project:

при создании sfx-cabа в sed-файл в секцию [Options] добавь ручками строчки в самом конце
--------
TargetWin9xVersion=4.10.2222
TargetNTVersion=4.10.2222
--------
и не нужно будет всех предупреждать о том что это только для winSE - в другое место просто не поставится

I'm only not sure how these options work - they seems to be completely undocumented. Or didn't I catch something?

It would be also very nice to be able to limit the installation to specific language version only too.

Petr

This check is in the SP since the version 1.2, probably eGorZ saw it in the SP. They're undocumented, but I tested them, they works.

Language checking is a good idea, but it's not as easy as version checking.

I'm sorry, I forgot to look into the SED file.

I just entered TargetWin9xVersion in Google and found one reference only - eGorZ's post on board.ru - nothing else.

Petr

Not problem.

Maybe I should make some web page about SED files and my INFEx tool. But there're many things to do (table for hotfixes, next version, forum, web page, school, work etc.) and I don't have time enough.

Hi Gape,

just an opinion - I think that the Service Pack for Windows SE should not be collection of freeware applications.

I have no idea why you decided to add Metapad to the final release.

There are thousands of similar possible replacements and it may be created some option pack with selectred applications - but in Service Pack?

And for other freeware applications - they are used just during the installation, right?
Are they open source? Who is the author? Will they work reliable in all environments?

I know there were long discussions about recommened installation order. Was there any consensus what is recommended? SE SP 2.0 contains many components of various packages, but not full packages, and also hotfixes to them. Sometimes the hotfix has the same version number as the original file so the preservation mechanism will not work I suppose (Maybe to increnet the version number?)

And example of packages that could be installed before or over SE SP 2.0
dun 1.4, dcom 98, dsclient, direct x (various versions), ie (various versions), wmi, nusb2.2, mdac, jet3.5, jet4.0, odbc drivers, vga drivers, chipset drivers, disk drivers, usb drivers, audio drivers, media player, office, upnp, various runtimes... or projects like se2me or revolutions pack.....
It is easy to find some death end.

Petr

Petr, you're right about that SP should not contain any freeware product, but I think Notepad should be a exception. I don't want to add any other freeware product into the SP. This Metapad totally free and freely distributable, and of course it's optional, however, we can change it with another open source alternative on the next version.

As I said before, I don't want to modify any file, so this is one of the reasons to add a Notepad alternative.

About your comments on preservation and installation order, do you have any example? I'm not sure that I understand it. You know, this pack (2.0) has installed on LOTS of systems, and it has tested since October 2004.

I agree with Gape that Notepad can be an exception.
Notepad comes with windows, after all. The original Notepad is realy out of age, and Metapad is very good choice as it looks very much like Notepad.

It should comes as an option however since some geek may have replaced their Notpad.exe file already.



Maybe you should add a warning at the end telling to check if all the devices and stuffs works properly and to reinstall the drivers if not.
With some explaination on how to do it.

Unfortunately is seems to be also totally unusable because of wrong display of accented characters. This is very good example of the non-tested behavior in all environmments I have mentioned in the previous post.
I still don't believe that it could be true.
This is the default setting:
http://www.ryston.com/x/metapad-2.gif
This is the same fon setting as default for notepad (Fixedsys)
http://www.ryston.com/x/metapad.gif
And this is how it should look:
http://www.ryston.com/x/notepad.gif

The problem is described at http://www.liquidninja.com/metapad/faq.html#Q20 - it means that it is well known and no chance for improvement. Contrary to the note in the FAQ upgrade to RICHED20.DLL (5.40.11.2212, Rich Text Edit Control, v4.0) from Ofiice XP did not help.
It means it is unusable for any language using Central European character set (codepage 1250) at least.
It is also 3 years old unsupported product.



So your opinion is that SESP2.0 can be installed at any stage - either immediately after fresh install of bare Windows 98 SE or on a system that is several years in use with many programs installed and all files will be in the desired state? If yes it would be great.

Petr

I'm still not sure that I understand it. Can you and/or Petr try to explain it?

Also note that, preserving mechanism is mainly based on registry keys, not on the version number. If Windows tries to install anything from Windows' CAB files, firstly it looks at the preservation list in the registry. For example, it want to install HyperTerminal files, it will install them from SP2.CAB. (So this should be noted that this preserving mechanism replaces original CAB files only.)

This problem exists on the most of Notepad alternatives that I've tested. This problem exists on FixedSys and Terminal fonts. However, there was not problem on my system (SP 2.0 installed) with Turkish characters on Metapad.

Do you know a small Notepad alternative which has similar look, and supports lots of languages, and doesn't have this problem?

What about Notepad2?

I should write that again: Metapad is optional, and is a simple NotePad product. It can be easily replaced. You don't have to add it into your localized version, too.

Please don't forget that Windows 98's Notepad is an at least 7 years old product.


I highly recommend that this pack should be installed on a freshly installed Windows 98 SE, if possible.

My opinion is that SESP 2.0 can be installed at any stage, too. We tested it on many systems, and on many cases. But I highly recommend that you should take a backup, if you have old Windows 98 SE installation.

Also we have a installation guide, we can improve it.

I can think of some users for whom the "unload dll's" from memory might not be so great. My grandmother, for instance, who only uses her computer for playing solitaire and checking email on AOL

Since thats all she uses it for, it speeds it up a little for her if the DLLs are already there next time she launches AOHELL

Hi,

maybe you can add native 24bit 192khz audio support into win98se into your next service pack. Just like the built in 24bit 192khz audio support in winxp.

I'd like to see some serious work put into some of OS/hardware limits we're bumping against, like getting 98se to accept 2gb of ram, 137gb hdd probs and such. I think this would help move 98se more into todays technology Gape & all involved, many, many thanks for the improvements in the OS you people have sweated over

PS: I use notepad+, been for long time and know how to change out, so no prob to me which you use

I think you should leave out all notepad replacements.

Everybody knows that windows notepad sucks but I don't believe that your service pack should install a replacement.

A lot of people think that Internet Explorer sucks. That doesn't mean that your service pack should install Firefox or Opera.


On my computer, I have UltraEdit installed. In order to get UltraEdit to be the default editor in applications that have "notepad.exe" hardcoded, I've installed a stub application (provided by the UltraEdit guys) called notepad.exe that just launches UltraEdit instead. I don't want this stub application overwritten by the service pack.

Yes, I want to break these limits, too. Both of them are very important.

I'll try to find a solution for the both problems.


Krick, thanks for your comments. I think to replace this Notepad replacement with my old Notepad patcher. Maybe, it was wrong idea.

Note that: Metapad is optional, so it will not overwrite your stub application, if you don't select it.

So it should be installed right after an OS is installed? I could have sworn I read somewhere I was to install after updates and such...oh well!

As for suggestions, I have only one:

Anyway to disable the random reboot questions that Windows sometimes throws up? Not the one at the end of course, but I've had a few occassions where one or two steps into the install it asks if I want to reboot. I'm sure it's cause the computer is messed up, but still...anything? Maybe AutoIT scripts or something.

And I forgot to mention that it's a great application, thanx you ever so much for it. Sometimes I forget how much time developers put in and how little thanx you get

I think this "fix" would be a bad idea as you shouldn't punish the majority beacuse the minority run 16megs of ram. Now-a-days, it's pretty easy to gather 32 or 64 megs of memory for the old Win98 boxes.

Agreed.


And what about trying to break the 64K fixed limit of resources ? What a pity I can't run more apps simultaneously because of it. If it could be only doubled to 128K it would be super bonanza already.

As well I thought about an add-on pack with all the good MS freebies from the resource kits, kernel toys, power toys, preptool, etc.. some of which aren't on the 98SE CD and none on the ME one.

As well maybe would be interesting to have a solid pack of additional runtimes that are commonly used such as VB, MFC, Borland, etc.. and whose versions are known to be the most stable on 9X, etc. I think I have noticed that sometimes the latest aren't the best on 9x nowadays. It will probably become more and more true as times goes by. I think such a pack should be a one click one should be able to overwrite any newer file version. It would include WinPcap which is a must install on a 9x system as well I think.

Another idea would be to have a one click up to date multimedia runtimes pack including all the additional freebies such as the video encoding tools and maybe some more such as the Quick time and Real players as well as some open source filters (ffdshow notably and maybe some free DVD playback filters and Asio drivers) but including WMP 9 only optionally.

eidenk


You want to make the SP bloat to 100Mb or what?
Freebies and media stuffs are a good idea, but they should come as a separate download.
Also such packs is often populated by obsolete codecs and softwares. That's why the Nemo codec pack project was abandonned.

No, I beleive SP should focus on "invisible" system improvement.

Instead of including hundreds of freebies, an htm file with links to their download location, and some description would be nice.

__________________________

Gape

I wanted to say that poeple on the verge of running SP should be told of making sure:
-they get the original w98se installation CD-rom (if not they shouldn't even consider trying SP)
-they get all their hardwares'driver installation disc
-they get a bootable floppy
-they backed up crucial datas on an external device (CD-R)
-maybe some other "paranoia" stuffs

Then after running the pack, be asked to check for conflict and system performance.
(You remeber the problem I had with the IDE?)

Notepad2 is a good replacement too.
Personaly I still prefer Metapad and metapad is also smaller, but Petr should check if it has the font display problem or not.

Check also the opening speed for large files (+-1Mb)...as it can differ dramaticaly from one program to another.

You want to make the SP bloat to 100Mb or what?

Sounds good to me

Perhaps there should be an Official Unofficial service pack as well as an Unofficial Unofficial service pack with added bloat.

GSPK

You mean... a hack of a hack of M$ updates?

i think 15-20mb is plenty twice ive had to download sp 2.o on dialup like 3 hrs whoa doggy beside if theirs no ie 6 or mp9 etc then i see no bloat thou id lov a sp with above in one easy to install exe .dare to dream .gape your sp2.0 works perfectly .

That is a general rule that should be followed, but I think we should allow exceptions to that rule in rare situations where we can get a big majority to agree upon something. Making the freeware/opensource extras optional during install is the way to go, but I think all of them already are optional arent they?




I personally prefer the patched notepad with the extra shortcut keys from rc3, mainly because it will stop everyone from arguing about what text editor to include.

I would like to see...

* XP color/Icons/Boot
* FFDSHOW as vfw codecs replacer
* Media Player Classic in place of Windows Media Player
* Move forces to ReactOS and/or E/OS LX !

Too mutch for my 1st post ?

Note: i'm an open source zealot...

Can we please add NTFS read support???

Check out the K-Lite Mega codec pack...
http://www.codecguide.com/

Service pack is a service pack, it's not a collections of free programs.

Gape, I think all these people are looking for something ala MS, you know, like an extras folder or something . Maybe you should just come out with "Gape's 98se revisited" or some such

how bout u throw the remaining hotfiles in add a complete tinhy revamping of the shell and call it the sp experience .throw in a magic dll lol

I agree, but i posted my request after reading 'Notepad vs. Metapad' posts, so...

Anyway, just for example, Media Player Classic could be considered an Update (don't M$ puts WMP 10 as an update ?) and FFDSHOW too.

Metapad will be removed on the next version.

MPC, vlc, BSPlayer, K-Lite Codec Pack, ffdshow, LAME etc. Where can you stop?

BSPlayer & K-Lite Codec Pack are not open sourced.

MPC & FFDSHOW are more in MicroSoft vein (more vfw) than VLC.

If you decide to put FFDSHOW you don't need anything other (for audio too).

(sorry i edited while you were answering...)

About NTFS: already discussed, and if i remember well... it's (almost) impossible.
Anyway here is an open source implementation: NTFS driver yes.gif

I suggest to take in some consideration OpenBFS wacko.gif

Cosmetic: Open source Icons/boots/walls whistling.gif

Another thing: do you think it's usefull (it possible) to 'update' DOS utils ? (format, fdisk, etc)

Gape:

New around here, but long in the game. I think that the notepad/metapad thing was 'splitting hairs' as it were, but good points were made on both sides. Let se if I've got some basic points down. The reason we're sticking with good ol' 98 is that it still, really, is good enough. On one side, maybe we run old, slow, PCs. We might like 'lean & mean' 'cause we're gamers, do audio/video work or crunch numbers. We like what we know. We like it simple. On the other hand, we're avoiding NT, 2000, XP and Win ME 'cause we don't like bloat, complexity or 'wizards'. We also don't like the control that has been taken from us by the new OS's, services and background tasks all over the place. Thats why it's the Unofficial Win98 SE Service Pack, not the Windows ME Service Pack. So far, an end user with no computer knowledge can use UW98SP and benifit from it. I've turned on a number of folks to it. So, I guess that's the bottom line. The end user. We're here 'cause we like being here, messin' around and, in a way, thumbin' our noses at ol' Bill. See what some folks have done with your OS (that took years, 10s of million dollars & thousands of poeple) in there spare time ? So, go get 'em! But don't lose focus.

Oh yeah, the notepad issue? Put in the original notepad with the 'file size limit' fixed. Keep it optional and 'uncheck' it. Maybe even check if there is a replacement notepad with an 'Are You Sure?' message.

I totally agree Nitebat, think we're getting far off track, there are still some basic issues that need addressing[2gb ram & 137gb hdd] rather than filling USP with a bunch of bloat. All prgms people want to add , they can add them on their own. There's still MDGx's fine 98se2ME and Tihiy's really nice Revolutions for those that want more! We're not looking to come out with a new OS, just bring a good prgm into modern computing levels.

Currently, the Add/Remove Programs entry reads...
“Unofficial Windows 98 SE Service Pack 2.0”

It would be helpful to add "(remove only)"...
“Unofficial Windows 98 SE Service Pack 2.0 (remove only)”
or when clicked it should ask “Are you sure you want to uninstall … ?”

At the current time, when you click on the Add Remove entry, it immediately uninstalls. I clicked on the uninstall to see if it might offer me the option of uninstalling Metapad and restoring NotePad. The result was that it uninstalled SP2, but did not restore Notepad. Not a biggie, I'm sure there is a way to restore Notepad. But thought I would offer this small idea as a result of my experience.

Unofficial Service Pack 2.0 is W-O-N-D-E-R-F-U-L! Thank you very much!

Lilla

In fact Metapad is Notepad with the file size limit fixed. Practicaly (cuz of course it's another program).
But I realy don't understand why some poeple would like to come back witht the old bad Notepad unless wof solid bug reasons.
Restoring Notepad is the simpliest thing to do. During the installation, rename Notepad.exe by Notepadold.exe, put Metapad in the Windows folder, rename Metapad.exe by Notepad.exe. During the uninstallation, just do the reverse actions: Delete Notepad.exe and rename Notepadold.exe by Notepad.exe.
It shouldn't take more than 50 charachters in a batch script.

__________________________________________________

request

A fix for CD-drive error crashes. For example, trying to copy I-dont-know-why defectuous cd, Nero and CD-ex both freeze up and the computer stop responding.
Because two programs get this bug, I think it's rather system wise.

Try to uninstall Adaptec/Roxio ASPI drivers if using Nero or uninstall Nero ASPI drivers if using Roxio Easy CD.
They are known to conflict with each other in 95/98/ME.
More info:
http://www.mdgx.com/drv.htm#CDR

* Adaptec Standard ASPI Layer 32-bit Windows 9x/NT4/2000/ME/XP/2003 Drivers
for (E)IDE/ATAPI/SCSI CD-R(W)/DVD-R(W)/DVD-RAM drives (free, English):
- ASPI v4.71.2 for Windows 98/NT4/2000/ME/XP/2003:
http://www.adaptec.com/worldwide/support/d...=aspi_471a2.exe
Direct download [510 KB]:
http://download.adaptec.com/software_pc/aspi/aspi_471a2.exe
If using Windows NT4, 2000, XP or 2003 you MUST apply the "GET BACK YOUR
CD/DVD" ASPI Fix from TIPSXP.TXT (included)!
- ASPI v4.60 for Windows 95/OSR1/OSR2:
http://www.adaptec.com/worldwide/support/d...ekey=aspi32.exe
Direct download [282 KB]:
http://download.adaptec.com/software_pc/aspi/aspi32.exe
Bart's ASPI Guide:
http://www.nu2.nu/aspi/
Radified ASPI Guide:
http://aspi.radified.com/
Force ASPI:
http://www.radified.com/ASPI/forceaspi.htm
IF using Windows 9x/NT4/ME MUST install EITHER Adaptec/Roxio OR Ahead/Nero
ASPI drivers, NOT BOTH!

* Ahead Nero Standard ASPI Layer 32-bit Windows 9x/NT4/2000/ME/XP/2003 Drivers
for (E)IDE/ATAPI/SCSI CD-R(W)/DVD-R(W)/DVD-RAM drives (free, English):
http://www.nero.com/en/ASPI_Driver.html
- ASPI Driver for Windows 9x/ME [95 KB]:
ftp://ftp6.nero.com/NeroASPIen.exe
- ASPI Driver for Windows NT4/2000/XP/2003 [157 KB, right-click to save!]:
ftp://ftp6.nero.com/wnaspi32.dll
IF using Windows 9x/NT4/ME MUST install EITHER Adaptec/Roxio OR Ahead/Nero
ASPI drivers, NOT BOTH!

If nothing works, maybe your CD drive is defective?
In that case u need a replacement or a new 1 if out of warranty.

Hope this helps.

First ... let me say ... I LOVE WIN98 SE SP 2

As someone who thinks Win98 is the best OS for any PC, it's great to have something that not only updates, but gathers together all the best ideas into one area. It's the way software always should be.


Anyway, my favorites include:
---------------------------------------------------------
-- Notepad. WOW! This is so much better than the original. Anyone that doesn't like it must also prefer to wash their clothes in a running stream instead of using a washing machine.

-- Color/Icons. Makes me feel like I bought a new OS recently (but didn't).


My FULL INSTALL order:
---------------------------------------------------------
FORMAT C: /Q /S
MKDIR C:\WIN98
COPY F:\WIN98\*.* /v
C:\WIN98\SETUP /ie /is /iv

modify (Network Server, DMA settings, remove LoadPowerProfile, Windows Logon, etc.)
install DirextX-9.0c
intall drivers (sound card, printer, display, monitor, etc.)
install Windows Update Internet Pack (MSIE6sp1) from CD
install 98SE SP2.0
install drivers (modem, USB devices, etc.)
install .NET Framework 1.1 (+patches)
install Media Player 9.0 (+patches)


Some questions:
---------------------------------------------------------
-- MS released MDAC 2.8 SP1 on 5/10/2005. Will that be included someday? More importantly, is there *any* MDAC upgrades installed?

-- There are critical updates that need to be installed:
KB890923 - Cumulative Security Update for Internet Explorer Service Pack 1
KB837009 - Cumulative Security Update for Outlook Express Service Pack 1
KB833989 - VGX Security Update for Internet Explorer Service Pack 1
KB870669 - Data Access Components (ADODB.steam)


I'm overall HIGHLY impressed with what has been accumulated, created and discovered. The combined input with the skill of someone to put it all together is amazing!


I just may completely reinstall windows every 4 months now ... just for the fun of it!

at all, im very satisfied by the actual pack...

some minor enhancements i would like to see....:

- as selectable option: exchange the browseXX.XXX stuff for the unlagging version from ie5.5

- also as selectable option : small, powerfull substitutes for notepad and taskmanager

- optional: an cpucooler (like k-cpucooler) because win98 do no automatical powersaving cpu-idleing (unlike 2000 or xp)

- most of the win98se users run also older hardware.... so i would like to see some
performance enhancing patches for special hardware like VIA chipsets or Amd k6 cpus....

http://www.georgebreese.com/net/software/ VIA chipset patches
http://www.upgradeability.com/K6plus/compatibility/ctu.zip k6 patch
http://www.liaokai.com/softw_en/cputool.htm cpu software cooler (kcpu cooler runs for me without problems for years now)

mdac 2.8 sp1 won't be in the 98se sp. KB890923, KB837009 & KB833989 require IE6 SP1 & OE6 SP1 so those will also not make it into the SP.

KB870669, definitely add that onto the next version of the SP as it is just some registry fix.

The revised "Root Certificates Update" which was re-released early Feb. 2005 should also be added. The root certificates patch can be found here:
http://download.windowsupdate.com/msdownlo...en/rootsupd.exe
Microsoft revises this patch at least twice a year. So Gape might want to include this newly revised patch into the next release of the 98se SP.

Good find! This is version 7. I have checked Czech Windows Upadate, and there is still only version 6, as well as in Gape's SP. This is international update, LANG=*, so I have no idea why it is available on English Windows Update only. Anyway, it sould be updated.

Petr

No, it was old self-burn audio cd that had something defective, on a rare occasions... (1/50).


Yes. Thanks MGDx, I have saved these infos in my Tips archive!

Well I think one really needs a good physical memory manager for example running permanently as a background task. Way before thinking of CPU cooling which is an issue for overclockers only. I'll begin a specific thread about all that as it seems there is a push towards creating an add-on pack of essential utilities. Indeed after installing all service packs and everything, many standard things need to be installed in my view to make the system fully functional such as a CD burner, a DVD player, an archive manager and so on.

Here is the small thingie:
Idler is a very old thingie which i've found in the deeps of archives.
Its idea is simple: it patches Windows 9x kernel when loaded to provide automatic cpu halt when idle, saving power. It occupies only 4KB and does not stay in memory!

I haven't tested it well, but maybe u'll find it useful.

About software CPU coolers: check this website ( [quiteOT]: does anyone knows an open source CPU idler ? Thanks in advice ).

So, as you can read, many peoples consider the media player as a part of the OS...

(quoting myself)

I always listen music and watch videos on my PC but I never use Windows Media Player. I think I have even deleted wmplayer.exe from the directory.


So the 9nth version, you can keep it were you know!

apparently 98SE does do this if it properly installed on an ACPI BIOS
i asked about it here -
http://www.msfn.org/board/Hlt-98-98se-Acpi-t39650.html
but no one followed up

some other links saying much the same thing -
http://forum.iamnotageek.com/t-11618.html
http://freespace.virgin.net/richard.amuzu/overclock.htm
more can be found via Google with a decently aimed search


http://win32assembly.online.fr/
down the page a bit, cpIce 1.12 (with source)
btw these things are somewhat cpu & chipset dependant.