is file sharing software or peer to peer legal ?
do you use these software ?

Personally I would never download any of these softwares onto my machine, firstly in order to share files with other people on the net you need to have some sort of spyware installed on your machine, so that other peole from the outside can access your files when you are online, most of these P2P applications come bundled with all sorts of rubbish which is very difficult to remove from your machine.

File sharing, like movies, music and applications is copyright theft and therefore illegal.

Thank you for your fast reply
you are very strong that you can keep yourself from downloading all that librarry
of new movies, software,.... in order not to break copyright laws.

actually i'm using them but i'm feeling that is something wrong...

its legal as long as u dont dl copy protected material

Kazaa lite contains no spyware of any type and I have tried loads of bittorrent clients and none have ever contained spyware of any kind. As wherever it is legal or not I use Bitspirit as my bittorrent client and download gigabytes of content monthly but all is legal from sights such as Filerush & 3dgamers for game demos etc. Also a lot of free application are now switching to bittorrent for user downloads because it takes strain of there servers and there for lower costs, example being OpenOffice

Like I said, copyright material is illegal to P2P, however freeware isnt, and unfortunaly I read in the newspaper that a lady was just fined £13,000 because her daughter was file sharing music (copyrighted), I would sooner pay £8.99 for a CD than pay a £13,000 fine. Sony and a few other record company's currently surf the NET looking for people with drives full of shared software.

First off Seanie's Show everyone is aware that music, game & film companies try to hunt down those sharing copyright material but 100 of millions of people have download p2p software ever since napstar kicked it off in a big way. Do you really think they are going to catch YOU downloading one album etc. You have more chance in winning the lottery. Also they do not look for people with drives full of software there is no way they would win in court if they did that because to do that they will have to hack your system . They try put dummies files on the net and monitor who downloads them they then log the ip address of that person and find out who and where you are. But as I said the likely hood of them actualy catching You is like a zillion to 1 and why people do download illegal files they also still by music and the companies do not want to prosecute there customers so they do a odd prosecution here and there to scare people like YOU off the idea. There are also apps out there that block the ip addresses of the companies trying to monitor you so they will then be unable to get your ip address

Peerguardian is free fast and effective: http://methlabs.org/projects/peerguardian-2-windows/

Also Bitcomet is a great bittorrent client for download torrent files(legal obviously): http://www.bitcomet.com/

There are many apps that are free and starting to use bittorrent.
For game demo's I suggest you check out http://www.filerush.com/ everything on there is 100% legal.

Like Astalavista said ... The use of P2P is legal. What u do with it, is something that can be illegal.

I have used P2P do download some things I needed ... Dont use it now very often tho. Fakes are all over the networks and its quite boring download a 4GB fake file.

You cant be talking about bittorrent I have or not one I know has ever en counted a fake file on bittorrent. It works in a completely different way to kazza etc., kazaa just lists all the files on your pc on bittorrent you have to first upload each and every file.

Thanks for all of you...great information

Its legal for approximately another year in Canada, until they approve Bill C-60 (sort of like the US's DMCA)...

P2P is legal. It has many legitimate uses everyday. Use common sense!

thats a tough question i guess it comes down to what your dl'ing,,, id say most of it no

Spoofed files are rampant on the networks Kazaa uses because Kazaa only hashes the first 256kB of files, in order to speed things up. Kazaa is thus vulnerable to spoofing where the first 256kB of any given spoofed MP3 was identical to the proper MP3, and the following data is, at best, scrambled MP3 frames.

BT hashes the full file, and collision attacks on SHA1 require something like 2^69 hash operations. The files can't be spoofed, but they may still be "fake", in the sense that the file is not what the torrent or filename indicates it to be.

Heh, ofcourse it's legal.

..Amazing that this thread exists really.

i could care less if it's legal. i'm a rebel
DC++ and peer guardian - no spyware/bloatware/adware or any other crap. i have yet to d/l a fake with this combo.

Actually it depends on the laws of your country. Here in Canada it is legal to download, yet it's not legal to upload.

Also if your going to use P2P DO NOT USE Kazaa, WinMX, Grokster, iMESH your going to get 99% spyware, and 150% of fake files and viruses.

If your intent, then download a bit client, like Bit Tornado, Bit Comet, ABC, Azureus, etc. etc. Or use eMULE (ED2K), mIRC, LimeWire, Shareaza. And find a nice P2P forum to assist you like p2pforums.com

So canada has no copyright laws currently?? (haha its sad, I live here and I don't even know the laws )

We have copyright laws, but it's not illegal to use P2P, it's legal to download, but not to upload. It's kindda FUBAR, the MP/RIAA are trying to get Canadian law makers to change this, but we're too laid back to pay them much heed.

Illegal in Norway, as far as I know.

I just don't get it, are you talking about P2P (peer-to-peer) filesharing apps or downloading/uploading copyrighted material?

It's NOT synonymous folks!

most of downloads from filesharing are copyrighted materials like new movies,
full software....
so it is the same subject.

I think there is no problem with the P2P here in egypt.

yes i know Mamoun, but do you think that's right ? to use hacked software
and watching theft cam movies...

also i want to know if i'm using the hacked software personaly at home and i don't make any money from it... is this right?

No it is theft regardless of whether you copied it on to anyone else, sold it or hacked it yourself, it is theft! These companies, sometimes very small and with limited resources have staff to pay etc and your helping to put them out of business - plain and simple. However I think that if your even asking this question you already know that its wrong! But thats not to say the Copyright Police will soon be breaking down your door either - thats highly unlikely, youve a far greater chance of winning the lottery - its more a moral dilema!

As for p2p technology, theres nothing wrong with it. You wouldnt blame Smith & Wesson because their guns are used to kill people would you? As someone else has pointed out BitTorrent is used by companies, many Open Source projects etc, to help with the cost of their bandwidth. I have helped seed many files legitimately to help out open Source projects, - dont blame the tools, blame the tradesman!

hmmm. p2p is kool, but here in India its cheaper and easier to get pirated movies from the street than download them. If i keep my comp on 24x7 for a whole month, i can download like a max 8 movies (slow bandwith ) so the cost comes up to (800/- bucks for the net connection + the electricity connection and the waiting ) whereas i can rip a movie off the street for just 70/- bucks. and you have vendors at every corner selling movies and software.

all i can use p2p is to get episodes of DBZ, southpark, chappel, n tv shows.

Thank you so much...

H4c|>InG |z C00| !~*>!

This question is an old debate, but it is still a valid one to ask.

Is it right? Well, that has a lot to do with how you view the copyright laws themselves, who they were intended to benefit and who they now actually benefit. I would argue that the current laws regarding copyright and incidentally patents are woefully in need of reform as they've lost their original intent of protecting the work of individuals and fostering innovation.

Currently, the major beneficiaries seem to be extremely large corporations with huge political clout. They are afforded all the same rights as single individuals without accounting for their colossus - their ability to ignore, overwhelm and otherwise overtake an individual. That needs to change. Ask any musician if it is they or the labels who benefit. I personally have known folks who have invented things that have netted their companies in the millions and they were rewarded with....squat!

One was a medical device for transfusing one's own blood back that required some tricky engineering and some clever insight to get it to work right. He got taken off the project and got a $1000 bonus - the company made several million on it and continues to do so today.

Another friend who worked for HP years ago developed a very much faster A to D convertor that was being used more in more in electronics (think sound). Though it has been surpassed today, at the time we went round and round on it and ended up not tryin to patent it because he knew from working at HP that patents would be ignored if they could profit from it. They would've tied him up in court along with any cash he had and essentially prevented him from production. He ended up shelving the idea.

I used to be very gung ho about "property rights" and felt the Chinese were just laughing at us because they ignored our system of copyright. However, while I don't believe it is right to steal from somebody, I also don't feel it is right to allow the big guys to crush the small ones. The case of the guy who eventually won against Sears after they stole his idea for the socket wrench after 16 odd years and destroying his life in the process is a rare one indeed!

The current laws not only discourage true innovation and protect huge multinational coporations as they manipulate markets, but they also don't take into account the vastly different environment the Internet presents us. Those who've embraced the net have often found that it can increase book and music sales, not hinder them. I know some authors who told their publishers they'd put their books on the net, much to the horror of the publisher, only to find 50%, 100% or more increases in sales volume!

The forces of the RIAA and MPAA arenot going to go away lightly, nor will we be able to easily convince our politicians that the current laws are outmoded, unworkable and counterproductive. Perhaps, the activity is one way of age old and respected silent protest.

Is it right? Probably not according to a strict interpretation of the current legislation. But, then again, jay-walking is also against the law in most cities that I know or have lived in. The idiocy of mamking a few xerox copies of pages in a book was thankfully addressed by the Fair Use doctrine in the US years ago, though the UK is more fanatical about that sort of thing.

Most of the large software houses have a love/hate relationship as a certain amount of it is very cheap advertising indeed so they don't really want to shut it completely down. On the other hand, they don't want to send the message that it's okay either. They get self-righteous about it, but in fact could easily stop it - they'd just lose customers in the end and they know it. Look what happened to Quicken! They got speared for adding activation like others had already done! They backed off in a hurry! I know folks who work there and they ain't poor!

This question won't get settled quickly, nor will it get settled here. I just know that I've come about 180° from my former position on it. Besides, I've been a beta tester since 1996 or so and as soon as MS or others finally release a full system that's ready for prime time, I'll consider getting out of the beta program. I pay for things like Dieter Prilfing's FmView (www.windowscorners.com) because it simply works as advertised and continues to do so. He deserves the recognition. Bill P's WinPatrol is another example, and I'm sure many of you have others.

@DonDamm:

Short version please....

Okay, the short version.

Peer-to-peer is legal.

How's that?

thats much better..... actually your post has a lot to say

Also have you been reading this topic?
Link: http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?showtopic=49457

yup yup!

Lets all try to stay away from talking about P2P like it is synonymous to illegal activities like "stealing" copyrighted material and so on.
Even though I sure know that the bigger part of the data passing through those apps are indeed just that.
It's all about keeping our freedom and liberty to make our own choices, what is trying to be done is simply limiting our possibilities to make our own decisions...I mean, I still can choose if I wanna keep that speedlimit..(that would actually endanger myself and others, with the possibility of accidents that would cost suffering and money for our collective economy).
This is a fact, everybody knows this.
...and know now they have actually gotten this far with this P2P hunt that ppl actually are discussing in terms of the P2P phenomena or application is legal on not, and wanna make the applications itself illegal....truly amazing!
And all wrapped up in a sorry a** "protect the artist/individual" mantra.

I still wanna make my own decisions, P2P programs is a excellent tool for sharing material, grabbing distros and so on...it's should perfectly enuff to have made the action itself of downloading/sharing stolen stuff illegal.

WRd-P DAwG! keep the fredom, spread the liberty, enjoy America!

L8-

Yes, I have been following it and other aspects for a while. I truly think the enterainment moguls need to rethink their business model and strategies. They've only been hurting themselves by treating their customers as criminals and thieves.

In the US, however, the RIAA is permited to hack computers, laws very from location to location, be sure your getting the laws that apply to you.

That sounds like the erstwhile Orrin Hatch of Utah!! He actually advocated that destruction of people's data or even hardware damagingj code!! Really. You should've heard him. He really has no clue. sigh.

P2P is legal. Just downloading copyrighted music and such is not. Even the use of warez is legal, as long as you uninstall it after one day of using it.

When thinking about and discussing the question of one of the best developments that have ever happened to the world, ie P2P filesharing, please widen the scope of your thinking to include the question of the legitimacy of the 'Law'.

Here are some generic points to consider:

1)
"The law locks up the man or woman
Who steals a goose from off the common,
But leaves the greater villain loose
Who steals the common from under the goose".
(15th century, English, Anonymous)

2)
Everything the Nazis did in WW2 was legal. Everything.

3)
With regard to drug laws in every nation on the planet that are members of the United Nations, these were, in general, decided by the United States in 1961 when it presented the UN with the list of banned substances it wanted every other country to adopt for their own countries. How legitimate are these laws when not one person in each of these countries had a say in them?

3)
Copyright restricts how you are legally allowed to use a product - if this was applied to motor cars - who would buy a car that you weren't allowed to pick up any passengers, or drive it on a particular day, or drive it so far, etc? No one of course, and the car makers would be vilified all over the world. For some reason, record companies got away with it.

So, if I was debating someone about P2P filesharing and the point was brought up that it is against the law, my reply is simply 'when injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty.'

The point to make is: Laws aren't universal truths, they are created within particular circumstances - which is why two countries could have exactly opposite laws on the same issue.

If you really couldn't be bothered to argue, the best snappy reply to " ... but its against the law!" is to retort "the law is an arse then" (or you could also say 'property is theft' but that one is a bit abstract and not as satisfying to say)