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Multimedia Class Scheduler Is it needed? Rate Topic: -----

#41 User is offline   anonymous_user 

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Posted 21 May 2008 - 08:28 AM

View PostTranceEnergy, on May 20 2008, 05:58 PM, said:

If this is causing you stuttering, can i ask what cpu you have?

Athlon 64 3200+ @ 2.4GHz.

View Postcable_loco, on May 20 2008, 08:43 PM, said:

Try importing the following code into your registry and reboot.

What do those registry changes do?


#42 User is offline   TranceEnergy 

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Posted 21 May 2008 - 09:07 AM

I think cable loco is referring to registry changes to stop/disable the services. But you must also remove the dependencies in order for everyything to work, that is sound. If you are running overclocked system and reporting things dont work, you shouldnt do that. A system can be prime stable 3dmark stable etc even if its overclocked, doesnt mean it will run perfect in every way.

#43 User is offline   anonymous_user 

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Posted 21 May 2008 - 10:42 AM

I think tweaking the critical worker threads setting helped a little but Ill just keep MCS enabled.

This post has been edited by anonymous_user: 21 May 2008 - 11:02 AM


#44 User is offline   TranceEnergy 

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Posted 21 May 2008 - 11:44 AM

I have successfully forced system into stuttering when playing back video.

I managed to get system stuttering when compressing a 10GB+ vista image at 500 000+ files, while installing server 2008 uncchanged in Vmware, and utilizing 400 connections in utorrent, and upgrading firmware on my dvd burner while also playing back 1080dp movie.
Since Vlite (and its pkg manager) only utilizes 1 cpu core, no matter if u got a quad even!, everything ocurred one 1 cpu core.

However, having both MMCS and WAPB service enabled and active doesnt help stuttering at all. In fact, disabling/enabling the WAPB service is where i could notice difference, as audio volume was lowered, and latency of sound increased a bit. Also DPC latency checker gave them thumbs down.

So for me it doesnt help having these services enabled, infact it increased stuttering, plus the difference from having WAPB service disabled is so refreshing in regard to system delay of sound.

On a sidenote, starting up quake 3 at dedicated on core 1 (or core "2" if u will, cores are counted from 0,1,2,3 for a quad), went happily along with it when extra audio services disabled.

Definitively keeping them off here.

#45 User is offline   Petrarca 

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Posted 21 May 2008 - 08:47 PM

View PostLegoLiam™, on May 20 2008, 12:45 AM, said:

Just for your information, not everyone uses vLite so vista run faster.... i use vLite because i don't like having things i don't need, i hate junk. I got a Quad-Core n 4TB of hdd space, full vista runs fine but i just really hate junk. So please don't be as hostile.

Same here, I just don't like stuff to be as extremely bloated as it is. If the slimmed-down stuff runs faster, that's a nice plus on top of it.

#46 User is offline   TranceEnergy 

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Posted 22 May 2008 - 07:09 AM

View PostPetrarca, on May 22 2008, 04:47 AM, said:

View PostLegoLiam™, on May 20 2008, 12:45 AM, said:

Just for your information, not everyone uses vLite so vista run faster.... i use vLite because i don't like having things i don't need, i hate junk. I got a Quad-Core n 4TB of hdd space, full vista runs fine but i just really hate junk. So please don't be as hostile.

Same here, I just don't like stuff to be as extremely bloated as it is. If the slimmed-down stuff runs faster, that's a nice plus on top of it.


Exactly. I have more hdspace then you two combined but i dont brag about it as legoliam.
The point is of course to run windows or any operating system for that matter, without any unecessary baggage. Dont need it, dont want it, couldnt care to keep them =) Now if only we could rename admin account with vlite i'd be so overjoyed, it's causing some weird issues if you enable the account and then delete the installation account.

#47 User is offline   nuhi 

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Posted 22 May 2008 - 07:40 AM

Is it just me but without MCS the sound in movies or music gets more easily interrupted while copying big files (few GB) on the same hdd?

#48 User is offline   Legolash2o 

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Posted 22 May 2008 - 08:34 AM

View Postnuhi, on May 22 2008, 02:40 PM, said:

Is it just me but without MCS the sound in movies or music gets more easily interrupted while copying big files (few GB) on the same hdd?


Nope, i played a DVD movie while copying a HD (all on the same hard drive) and nothing wrong, then i put on a 780p HD movie and copied another HD to the same HDD and still nothing.

But it might depend on how fast ur hard drive is (SATA2) and what player you use (i used VLC).

#49 User is offline   nuhi 

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Posted 22 May 2008 - 08:42 AM

My drive is ok (WD Caviar 750GB).

Player is MPC HC edition.

Upgraded the latest Intel chipset/sata drivers and so on. Vista is known for this issue, well if someone knows the cause, except removal of MCS let me know.

#50 User is offline   Legolash2o 

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Posted 22 May 2008 - 09:09 AM

Go to Device Manager > Disk Drives > select a harddrive > policies and try ticking enable advanced performance. Do this to all the hard drives to see if that helps :)

#51 User is offline   Innocent Devil 

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Posted 22 May 2008 - 01:26 PM

@ LegoLiam™
that will be bit serious if sme crach occured, u will lose the disk cache
Read:
The Power of Bugs

This post has been edited by Innocent Devil: 22 May 2008 - 01:27 PM


#52 User is offline   nuhi 

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Posted 22 May 2008 - 01:52 PM

LegoLiam, I know about that but it can't be enabled with mine. I enable it, press OK and when I go back it is again disabled.
It could be because mine is set to SATA AHCI mode but it also could be that Intel drivers block that.

This post has been edited by nuhi: 22 May 2008 - 02:27 PM


#53 User is offline   TranceEnergy 

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Posted 22 May 2008 - 02:40 PM

nuhi, i've got amd chipset and it runs successfully with the advanced write options enabled. Think you're right about it could be a driver thing.

#54 User is offline   anonymous_user 

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 04:08 PM

I just made a new observation: on another computer that has Realtek HD onboard audio, disabling Windows Audio Endpoint Builder caused audio to not work.

However disabling Multimedia Class Scheduler is ok. Maybe because the computer has an Athlon 64 X2 4800+?

#55 User is offline   TranceEnergy 

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 10:56 PM

View Postanonymous_user, on May 24 2008, 12:08 AM, said:

I just made a new observation: on another computer that has Realtek HD onboard audio, disabling Windows Audio Endpoint Builder caused audio to not work.

However disabling Multimedia Class Scheduler is ok. Maybe because the computer has an Athlon 64 X2 4800+?


Essentially to cut things short here, you NEED to have both off to get full effect to get closer to understanding what i am talking about =)
Keeping waepb service running = higher latency of sound then if off...

IF however, you like sound effects, think having stuff like EAX sound effects, you will need at least waepb service enabled. Possibly both services.
you can however, set manual effects yourself. Also third party tools will most likely work, remember its WINDOWS services/software here, not something from your sound card manufacturer. Unless things are written to depend on this from other third party software, nothing should stop you basically.

I have a x2 5000 black edition (overclocks awesome), and i had no trouble running without both.
Im running with Azalia chip enabled in bios, doesnt matter for sound per se, but check if you have it.

While people around the world are reporting that disabling mmcs helps filecopy speeds and what not, i tested to some extent that when also stopping
the waepb service, latency of sound dropped quite much.
I could literally hear the difference while in games, and i was complete awe of the difference
between i could react to sound.

I checked with quake 3, which is very old game, and as you might know is a *VERY* tweakable game. You can change about 800 settings, not including making binds/scripts/modification cvars.
So anwz, i tweaked sound to be played a half second before it was started, i cant explain it otherwise, and to my complete suprise i reached a new low there at a sustainable 0.4 seconds sounds being played off before they was actually played. I tested several times and found it very playable with 0.25 pre-playing or what i should call it, of sound. It totally kills fps (afaik max 300fps but more then enough) as cpu is being really pushed every millisecond, but gawd. Fatal1ty would killed to have that tweaked out setup.

Imagine that you hear everything, only 0.4 seconds faster then your enemy. I couldnt get anywhere near that without waepb and mmcs disabled and forgotten. If you are going to stay with vista for the time being, and you like games a bit more then your average office package, i'd strongly suggest
you do everything you can to these two services stopped, keeping only windows audio service enabled.

Possibly one of the other reasons why i was so successfull is because i had done a lot of tweaking to windows, but things like keeping aero theme off or disabled, doesnt really matter after sp1 of vista.

What i found that actually played a difference, was tweaking , of all things, the Easy of Access handicap settings.
Tweak that and combined with max performance of gui settings is a winner. Also if gaming, Keep windows desktop manager enabled, it's a must, long story. another time perhaps.

Now, on this same setup, and i have also a x-fi extreme gamer sound card. It was able to hold a 10fps faster in timedemos, on a really maxxed out quality settings, and not much different on low end gfx settings. Really disappointing but then again i kinda had that feeling it always was overrated. And thats also another story..


Happy tweaking!

#56 User is offline   Legolash2o 

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 12:53 AM

My sound still works fine with both "Windows Audio Endpoint Builder" and "Multimedia Class Scheduler" disabled :D


View PostInnocent Devil, on May 22 2008, 08:26 PM, said:

@ LegoLiam™
that will be bit serious if sme crach occured, u will lose the disk cache
Read:
The Power of Bugs


My computer hasn't crashed in a long long time so ill take the chance :)

This post has been edited by LegoLiam™: 24 May 2008 - 01:01 AM


#57 User is offline   TranceEnergy 

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 04:53 AM

Then check into getting rid of the dependencies for the network list and them 3 others so u still have internet/lan functionality.
There's just so much bloat in vista =( Just about anything you can think of, is enabled as default in vista, just so MS has all bases covered =(
I had vista running at 12 services with internet and all working, but seriously it requires too much effort for any average joey to get it working proper, as in the eNLIGHTeD way. I'd say when you can run a .net fully able vista with all eye-candy and that crap that makes vista, vista, at about 500MB and still have most support, it mature as nlite today is. (Nlite is on the verge of becoming a lot better i think). Atm that is about 1500mb here, but requires about 250 tweaks not counting group policy edits. I got that number by counting all my .reg exports. It's just insane, i love tweaking, but when you feel you have to start resource hacking because its just plain silly the stuff u get to see wandering about in registry and inf files etc, gahw.
A couple of more vlite versions perhaps by winter, things are looking brighter..

#58 User is offline   anarkhy 

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Posted 25 May 2008 - 03:35 PM

View PostTranceEnergy, on May 24 2008, 07:53 AM, said:

Then check into getting rid of the dependencies for the network list and them 3 others so u still have internet/lan functionality.
There's just so much bloat in vista =( Just about anything you can think of, is enabled as default in vista, just so MS has all bases covered =(
I had vista running at 12 services with internet and all working, but seriously it requires too much effort for any average joey to get it working proper, as in the eNLIGHTeD way. I'd say when you can run a .net fully able vista with all eye-candy and that crap that makes vista, vista, at about 500MB and still have most support, it mature as nlite today is. (Nlite is on the verge of becoming a lot better i think). Atm that is about 1500mb here, but requires about 250 tweaks not counting group policy edits. I got that number by counting all my .reg exports. It's just insane, i love tweaking, but when you feel you have to start resource hacking because its just plain silly the stuff u get to see wandering about in registry and inf files etc, gahw.
A couple of more vlite versions perhaps by winter, things are looking brighter..


what are the dependencies to remove for network?

#59 User is offline   TranceEnergy 

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Posted 26 May 2008 - 02:21 AM

Im in XP x64 atm so cant check service names, If anyone is going to tweak network services, please attempt it in a VMware or similiar, first. Messing with your actual host install is a bad idea, if you dont know how to revert things back to default, alas backup is handy:
(if u just skipahead, you miss out probably, plz read ;))

0: First, a reminder when messing around in registry and you know you will do something windows doesnt expect per se, i always unload/disable any thing on startup from run and runonce and whatnot registry keys as well as from startup folders. Also remember the hidden systemprofile. In addition, to tweaking network services, i would like to point out one other important thing that should be checked into before u get to that:

Task scheduler in vista. It contains a lot of program/task schedules,
that i *of all my heart and mind strongly suggest* you look into 1st.
I dont even know where to begin with that, but like disable and delete the bloody:
customer improvement experience program
trancient multi monitor manager (i have multiple monitors, and they worked just fine, its a laptop external monitor thingie tbs.)
The all upnp services (doesnt mean upnp wont work)
bluetooth unloaderloader service, as well as for wireless
disk defragging service
and boatload of totally other crap.

This is important: *EVERYTHING* is *connected* *somehow*, and if you tweak something, read:
do any action that disables something that something else relies one and when that tries to operate, and get answear it cant coz the service/program/task isnt available, isnt running, is deleted or whatnot, you end up getting system delays, event log errors, and all things could really,really crash and burn, and before you know it, you are thinking you need to reinstall. It's vitally important that anyone going about doing tweaking know their stuff, because unless you take precautions, as in backup, and you are prepared and have the time to fix the system, you should not be messing with services etc that could break functionality that you actually need. Either you are ALL-IN or you should stick with just disabling stuff that windows actually provides an option for. Going about in registry and services.msc for that matter, isnt to be taken lightly. And Vista is so bloated, it can quickly become a headache to keep it all together.

Enough bloated talk:


...

I'm simply saying im not responsible, lol, and take you PREcautions, being sorry afterwards isnt going to help. Having said all that :

Please read all of the following first before you start messing about on anything:

1: simply start services.msc on vista
2: Find f.ex network list service, and take note of the actual service name.
3: Start Regedit
4: F3 and input service name. Should start search under currentcontrolset (not 001 or 002, just "currentcontrolset) btw.
5: Export the registry key and check that it contains the service as original.
6: rinse and repeat for remaining network services, this is very important. you need this incase you make a total mess, or simply to be safe for that matter.
7: Now that all backup is done. You should check on your network adapter, that you UNCHECK things like iPv6 and everything except tcpipv4. The reason WHY you should to that, is because you are going to tell windows then, to not need any other network service, for the time being. This is good as you prevent, at least in theory, windows to access/start other things. And windows like to do things we dont want it to do, lol.
8: Now lets see, i have to think, hmm.. the utterly crappy IpV6, this is a whole other story as well. Crap.
Ah yes. You need to add to registry a Dword 32bit key, Called DisabledComponents.
Look just google "ipv6 vista" and disabledcomponents. It's a bitmap key and i believe the value should be 255, but dont take my word for it.

Im having a hangover, so bare with me lol =)

You see vista is so-called-made-for-the-future-and-is-by-default-enabled-for-all-such-new-s***-that-most-people-dont-actually-use.
But could perhaps use. Ipv6 is strongly built into vista and cant be taken away/disabled lightly. you need to also disable AFTERWARDS some of the network devices, under device manager, network devices, not your network card tho lol, so that you minimize ipv6 things.
Now i have long since realized this is too complicated to undertake explaining it all here, so should probably start another post and take more time to build the answear...

Anyway, you should by now have all things disabled in network, and removed dependencies, make sure in registry keys you have f.ex the RPC service standing and its a *empty* line beneath it, alas memory is failing me at this point but not all services dont necessarily have it. But its a crucial windows service anyway. dont mess with it. *period*.
Now check back on, enable, network lan on network card under network connections. you shouldnt need the new services, just keep printer/file sharing and sharing for microsoft network. Pain in the arse to explain this without reference lol =))))
all the network services you disabled, should not start even if set to manual.
However, do not panic if they do start, it simply means you have missed a service.

I think i failed utterly at explaining this, and feel i have forgotten something =(.
ANYWAY!
You would have at least managed to get a bit faster startup-time of vista, since you not having such network service on automatic, and they wont startup automatic before they are needed (they shouldnt be needed if u have disabled/removed all dependencies needed)
. IF all services start anyway before you have accessed lan, you have missed something. and of course, network connections service shouldnt be on auto.

I think you also need to disable something else not directly thought of as network. I just cant remember atm.

#60 User is offline   Etz 

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Posted 31 May 2008 - 12:55 PM

for my opininion ... " for OC`d Quad it`s fine to remove that...
It`s most likely thought for single-cores...
Dual Cores/Quad Cores + Creative X-FI...users live without it better... :thumbup

This post has been edited by Etz: 31 May 2008 - 12:58 PM


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