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Day-to-day running Win 9x/ME with more than 1 GiB RAM

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#151
Tommy

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Hey, thanks for the information you two. I don't know how to answer your last question Dencorso since I stopped eating fast food about 5 years ago but I imagine it's a bit up there these days. I really would like to max out my Win98 machine as much as I can and maybe even start using it more as a main machine instead of a secondary one since it takes less power being a Pentium 4 as opposed to Athlon 64 X2. RLoew seems awesome as hell when it comes to making 9x a lot better so probably soon I will take the dive in and get the patch. I remember when I ran Windows 98 in 2002 with only 384MBs of RAM, seems quite paltry now. lol


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#152
MrMateczko

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And the patch is not that expensive... what's the actual cost of one single hamburger (not cheeseburger) at the McDonald's nearest to you?

Some of us don't earn much...nor have good exchange rates...

Maybe make it free in the next 5 years?


Edited by MrMateczko, 26 December 2014 - 01:10 PM.


#153
jaclaz

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Some of us don't earn much...nor have good exchange rates...

In my experience very poor people :( cannot afford more than 512 Mb of RAM anyway, so it looks to me like a non-problem.

 

jaclaz



#154
dencorso

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(Which compares well with the more realistic 52.14 weeks per year,40h per week of work and US$7.25 per hour, which gives US$15120.60) .
Now, with Brazilian 13 months and Sao Paulo's US$370.00 per month, we'd have US$4810.00 per year. Then the buts begin: but the Big Mac Index (by applying it, the US$4810.00 is reduced by 35% to account to the higher costs here, becoming US$3126.50), but the Gini Coefficient and but the unemployment rate (6.0% in 2011). And Brazil has about 2/3 of the US population.


Just to keep up to date, the situation here has remained about the same (or improved minimally, if one wants to be optmistic): What then were US$3126.50, now became US$3589.50... (about 15% real gain after two years, that's not bad you'll say!)... I'll check the new Gini Coefficient and the unemployment rate and add that info later. Also it's really worth it to give a look at the new, interactive, at The Economist's Big Mac Index page. :yes:

 

The situation in Brazil didn't change much from the described above, till now. People earn about one fifth of what they'd earn in the US, and computer hardware costs about thrice their price in the US...

 

Maybe make it free in the next 5 years?

 
I wouldn't count on that.



#155
Tommy

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I actually purchased the patch last night and Mr. Loew delivered it last night to my email. He's a very pleasant person to work with and honest so no worries about him taking your money and running. I have the patch installed but I do not have RAM that will push my 98 machine past 1GB yet so that's on order. So I want to know, will I need to mess around with vcache and maxfilecache with the RAM patch or no?


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#156
rloew

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And the patch is not that expensive... what's the actual cost of one single hamburger (not cheeseburger) at the McDonald's nearest to you?

Some of us don't earn much...nor have good exchange rates...
Maybe make it free in the next 5 years?

I don't think McDonalds will ever make their hamburgers free.

@Tommy You don't need to set MaxFileCache when using my Patch in most cases.
You can still use MaxFileCache to lower it further as needed or use the /C option to set the maximum lower permanently. If you do a lot of writing to USB Keys, you may want to set it low.
The minimum is 40MB of Cache per Gigabyte of RAM.
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#157
LoneCrusader

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So I want to know, will I need to mess around with vcache and maxfilecache with the RAM patch or no?

 

No. That's the beauty of the RAM Limitation Patch - no more such fiddling is required. You install it and go on about using your system. I would do away with any such entries once the patch is in use.



#158
dencorso

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OTOH, even if not explicitly needed by Tommy's setup, I'd install the RAM Limitation Patch with the /M command-line option. It's harmless if unneeded, but I'll be already there if ever needed, and provides yet some more improvement to the memory management. BTW, there's no need to wait for the new RAM stick. Install the patch right away. It'll make your system stabler starting now. When the stick arrives, you can then add it, and it'll just work. [WARNING: It goes without saying that, of course, when adding the new stick, you must turn off the machine and, preferably, remove the cord from the wall socket, just to be sure, and then still wait for at least one minute for any caps to discharge, before adding/replacing hardware, as always.]
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#159
Tommy

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Thanks for all the help, guys! Dencorso, I actually have installed the patch already and I hopped down to my local computer shop just to see if they would have any 1GB DDR sticks but sadly, they didn't. But I might have a computer downstairs that I can try out with it that has 4 slots since I have plenty of 512MB modules. I didn't use the /M switch but I can always go back and fix that. I'm excited to have more than 1GB of RAM on Windows 98. I have a HP Media Center Pavilion that this could possibly work out on. I rescue many Pentium 4 and even a few very early Dual Core computers from the local computer shop and take them home instead of watching them go for recycle. But the sad thing is, many of them only have 2 slots on the motherboard which makes them hard to push past 1GB unless you have the 1GB sticks.

 

Also about your disclaimer, I also unplug the machine from the wall and hold down the power button to help discharge the electricity going through it. It's amazing on MBs with lights on them, how long they'll stay lit, even after you pull the power cord.


Edited by Tommy, 26 December 2014 - 08:58 PM.

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#160
dencorso

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Also about your disclaimer, I also unplug the machine from the wall and hold down the power button to help discharge the electricity going through it. It's amazing on MBs with lights on them, how long they'll stay lit, even after you pull the power cord.

 

Sure! My A7V600-X can go on almost one full minute before the LED finally goes dark. It's never too much to mention it, on motherboards with no charge indicator, one can easily fry a new memory stick because of not waiting long enough. Better safe than sorry!


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#161
Dave-H

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Thanks for all the help, guys! Dencorso, I actually have installed the patch already and I hopped down to my local computer shop just to see if they would have any 1GB DDR sticks but sadly, they didn't. But I might have a computer downstairs that I can try out with it that has 4 slots since I have plenty of 512MB modules. I didn't use the /M switch but I can always go back and fix that. I'm excited to have more than 1GB of RAM on Windows 98. I have a HP Media Center Pavilion that this could possibly work out on. I rescue many Pentium 4 and even a few very early Dual Core computers from the local computer shop and take them home instead of watching them go for recycle. But the sad thing is, many of them only have 2 slots on the motherboard which makes them hard to push past 1GB unless you have the 1GB sticks.

I'd be very surprised if you couldn't find some 1GB sticks of the right type on eBay.

There are many recycling firms that sell such bits of old hardware, I've had several old pieces of kit from them for my system.

:)


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#162
Tommy

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I'd be very surprised if you couldn't find some 1GB sticks of the right type on eBay.

There are many recycling firms that sell such bits of old hardware, I've had several old pieces of kit from them for my system.  :)

 

That's actually what I did, I found a 2GB kit on an auction for 4.99USD and it was nearly over and nobody bid on it so I did. I won it so aside from that and shipping, it was only 7.28USD. I didn't think that was too bad at all. If the need arises, I may even look for more kits like that. The surprising thing is, I'm starting to like Windows 98 more than Windows 2000. Windows 2000 is quite good to me but once in a while gets a bit temperamental and gets to the point I need to hit the reset button. I haven't seen a BSoD on Windows 98 in ages.


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#163
jaclaz

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 The surprising thing is, I'm starting to like Windows 98 more than Windows 2000. Windows 2000 is quite good to me but once in a while gets a bit temperamental and gets to the point I need to hit the reset button. I haven't seen a BSoD on Windows 98 in ages.

 

Windows 2000 or your peculiar install of Windows 2000 with a zillion of mods, patches, modified kernels, wrappers and what not? :unsure:

I mean, the former has not given issues of any kind in several installs, some still running, in the last 10 (ten) years, of course with it's limits on hardware and programs on them, the second (which I understand may be need patching in order to run on more modern hardware and running originally non-compatible versions of programs) is obviously far less stable.

 

jaclaz



#164
dencorso

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Well... I do agree with jaclaz! And what's more scary, even MS does!!! :ph34r:
Find here the report of the NSTL reliability study they've comissioned, a classic MS continues to keep available.
And, then, there's also the report of the ZDLabs reliability study, also still available (thanks to the Internet Archive, of course!).

Although this is off topic, there's also the report of the ZDLabs performance test, which link I provide here just to keep things somewhat related as together as possible.

#165
Tommy

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I think part of my problem isn't from the mods themselves, but it seems temperamental to wireless network adapters. When I get a BSoD, it's usually something network related. As for Windows 98, I had a laptop I used a wireless network adapter on and I've never seen such problems. When I'd download something using the adapter, it seemed as though it was always corrupt or had a bad crc checksum. Even though they work, I don't think wireless networks were designed for anything under XP, but that's just what I think.


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#166
rloew

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Network adapters, in particular Gigabit adapters, can cause problems with DMA Memory.
I originally developed the /M option in my RAM Limitation Patch to address this issue.
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#167
Tommy

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And my test is a success! My HP Pavilion Media Center edition had 4 slots on the motherboard and 512MBX4=2GBs less for the onboard graphics. Now I cannot wait to get the RAM for the computer this is to be used on. But it totally works!

 

2u9pnw1.jpg

 

Thanks for the awesome patch, Mr. Loew! I love rockin' Windows 98! :thumbup


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#168
Tommy

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Here's an update: My await RAM came today and I was able to throw it into my machine and voila, it booted up fast and without problems! It recognizes all 2GBs of it. I'm going to throw in an actual AGP card and my Windows 98SE computer will be quite a decent one. I will post screenshots later when I get to it.


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#169
dencorso

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This topic has been updated!

What's New?

on post #2:

Tommy's machine has been added. :yes:

Let's keep the list up-to-date:
If you are using 9x/ME with more than 1 GiB RAM, do PM me your info and you shall be added to the list!
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#170
relayer

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Hi guys,

 

Got RLoew's patch last night and applied about an hour ago, then shut down and applied new RAM (3 sticks@512).

 

On the first boot, system brought up the (blank) desktop & crashed to a bluescreen with corrupted characters (couldn't read error message). Rebooted and got in to Windows but was getting only 256MB recognized RAM. Also got these values from boot:

 

Memory Type    total    used       free
------------    -----   ----       -----
Conventional     640k    39k        601k
Upper                    0k     0k          0k
Reserved              0k     0k          0k
Extended (xms) 65,472k     ?    260,880k
---------------------   ----        ----
Total Memory   66,112k     ?    261,481k

Total under 1 MB  640k   39k        601k

Total Expanded (EMS)          64M(67,108,864 bytes)

Free expanded [EMS]           16M(16,777,216 bytes)

Largest executable program size     601k (614,960 bytes)
Largest free upper memory block       0k
MS-DOS is resident in the high memory area.

 

Question marks looked suspicious so I replaced the RAM sticks with the known good ones (1GB) and that's what I got.

Further experimentation revealed one bad RAM stick. Pulled the 2x256 & replaced with 2x512 again, testing stick by stick.

System booted fine and all screens, DOS & Windows, agreed on 1536 MB, huzzah!

 

Running memtest for awhile to shake down the newly-purchased 512 sticks.

 

I got to 28 open DOS sessions in Windows & thought that would be enough testing, but sure I could have gotten more.

 

As I said before, my quest is a bit different in that I am building a retro computer for gaming (the one I always wanted in the 90s lol) and it will dual-boot Win98se & WinXP because some old games are wanting DirectControl. Games and system monitors are the only programs going in.

 

I can report on how it performs after I get some games in it. The hardware & memory are looking good!

 

 

System:

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ATI 9800 Pro Agp 4/8x - 1.5MB RAM - Sound Blaster Audigy 2 ZS Pro Platinum
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#171
dencorso

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This topic has been updated!

What's New?

on post #2:

relayer's machine has been added. :yes:

Let's keep the list up-to-date:
If you are using 9x/ME with more than 1 GiB RAM, do PM me your info and you shall be added to the list!

#172
dencorso

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This topic has been updated!

What's New?

on post #2:

sanszajnrege's machine has been added. :yes:

Let's keep the list up-to-date:
If you are using 9x/ME with more than 1 GiB RAM, do PM me your info and you shall be added to the list!

#173
TELVM

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... on motherboards with no charge indicator, one can easily fry a new memory stick because of not waiting long enough. Better safe than sorry!

 

...  [WARNING: It goes without saying that, of course, when adding the new stick, you must turn off the machine and, preferably, remove the cord from the wall socket, just to be sure, and then still wait for at least one minute for any caps to discharge, before adding/replacing hardware, as always.]

 

^ That's sound advice. Even the smaller secondary caps in a PSU can store quite a bit of energy if not discharged:

 

 

Not to mention the bulk caps:

 






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