Rolenet

Using a NAS on Win9x?

18 posts in this topic

Hello everyone,

Does someone here succesfully uses a NAS with win98? (Read further if you want, I explain my attempt with a HD363N enclosure - doesn't work).

-- thanks

My failed NAS story :

Argosys / Inoi HD363N enclosure (SMB / FTP ethernet-only 3.5 IDE enclosure, WITH auto spin-off that works).

Works well with OSX and XP.

With win98, I can connect to it, browse the contents, set up shares, open files on it, copy to it, but I cannot copy from it (explorer says server is not available anymore). If I copy a file to it then back to the computer it works only on the first file copied (and even then it capitalize the file name).

Same goes with the FTP server.

I tried many things and many ways to copy files. I tried it directly connected to my laptop or through my wireless router. No cake.

I don't expect miraculous fixes but I wonder if I'm alone in this situation?

Config: Win98se, IE6.0 SP1, very few fixes or extras.

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Actually besides writing in BIG, FRIENDLY letters ;) you seem to fail to describe how did you actually setup your machine, which services have you installed, and which settings you are using, how the lan is setup, which FTP app you are using, etc. .

Would this be useful:

http://leenux.org.uk/lpackham/smbclient/

:unsure:

You can try using this:

http://winscp.net/eng/docs/introduction

it is also a FTP client.

or core FTP Lite:

http://www.coreftp.com/

to see if an "alternative engine" changes the behaviour.

jaclaz

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sorry, double posted by mistake. :blushing:

jaclaz

Edited by jaclaz
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Actually besides writing in BIG, FRIENDLY letters ;) you seem to fail to describe how did you actually setup your machine, which services have you installed, and which settings you are using, how the lan is setup, which FTP app you are using, etc. .

I wrote the rest in smaller letters because my question is not so much how to troubleshoot my setup as to know if there's actually someone using a NAS out there with Win98. I sort of believe it helps if the important points of my post pop up. (But thanks for the pointers nonetheless!).

I really don't know: maybe everybody here's using a NAS as I speak, and then maybe close to nobody... That would make quite a difference in my troubleshooting strategy!

Regarding my setup, I don't think a Samba client will do it as the HD363N (despite what's claimed on the box) apparently does not in fact has a SAMBA server.

Also, I did upload the latest firmware (a bad idea, because it prevents telneting, and I couldn't find old versions..).

-FF-

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what protocol are you using to communicate with the NAS?

while I do not have a NAS, I *am* interested in setting one up...

the specs say the harddive cannot be larger than 4 gigs.

how have you configured it through http?? you ought to be able to use the device's IP address to directly access it through the network- no server software needed.

http://192.168.0.whatever/

pops up user name and password prompt. fill it out properly. DO NOT CLOSE THIS BROWSER WINDOW.

go into a different standard explorer window (not IE). type that url (http://192.168.0.whatever) and hit return. You should be in it now. I do this all the time to get into broken networks on 98se.

how many partitions are on the hard drive?

what is the filesystem on the hard drive? It **has to be** FAT32.

did you create a user profile for the 98 box on the NAS? you have to use an actual password on the 98 box to get it to work... the 98 login name and password has to match the settings for the NAS. I remember 98 didn't like my network back in the day, because I used individual passwords for individual folders on my network... eventually it all fell down and I had to use the ONE name and password for my entire network (just so I could get a new XP box to work properly with the 98 client also attached)

interesting that the day I choose to do this myself, someone posts a problem about it.... :)

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what protocol are you using to communicate with the NAS?

The box has a SMB server, an HTTP server, a (disabled) telnet and a FTP one. I hope I get the terminology right. The HTTP connection (for administration purposes) works AOK. The FTP not so much, and the SMB one (through Window's networking through TCP/IP / Netbios,) does not work with copying from the NAS.

the specs say the harddive cannot be larger than 4 gigs.

Well, I have used a 60gb one and it's actually SOLD with 500gb drives pre-installed. It's true however that it can be finicky with the formating. You're better off formating it from the admin panel. However I succesfully installed my own FAT32 single-partition pre-formated disk with files on it.

The SMB server works with special folder shares you have to create from the interface (you get to chose their number, size, password). But you CAN create the shares from the interface, then unplug the drive and mount it in an USB enclosure and move the files into the special folders...

Btw it's not what causes the errors, I tried with another drive I formated from the interface.

how have you configured it through http?? you ought to be able to use the device's IP address to directly access it through the network- no server software needed.

That's what I did. It works well. Btw for this unit the default adress is 169.254.0.1, though it's configurable or DHCP aware.

did you create a user profile for the 98 box on the NAS? you have to use an actual password on the 98 box to get it to work... the 98 login name and password has to match the settings for the NAS. I remember 98 didn't like my network back in the day, because I used individual passwords for individual folders on my network... eventually it all fell down and I had to use the ONE name and password for my entire network (just so I could get a new XP box to work properly with the 98 client also attached)

I did not set passwords for the shares. There's only one for the admin panel and one other for the FTP user.

Do you mean to imply that I *should* define a password for win98 to work with it?

Edited by Rolenet
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it is worth a shot; that is what I have had to do on other systems with similar setups....

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FYI, I have a NAS in my home network. (1xW2000, 1xW98SE, 1xMandrive wired, 1xW95, 1xW98SE 1xUbuntu wireless, behind a 2nd router).

I first had a Fantec box based on an RDC 2882 chipset. There are (were?) lots of el-cheapo devices based on this chipset. They have a 100Mb network connection, and an USB connector (not to be used on the same moment). The (single) drive is formatted FAT32. The OS is NAS-BASIC.

This one worked well for my wired network (after upgrading the firmware with a newer version of a different brand). I had different usernames and passwords for the different shares. On the W9x machines I could only access the shares with the username of the current logon. When accessing a share, a box pops up which asks for the password, with no possibility to apply a username. The wireless W9x machines could not access the NAS for a long time. After about 10 minutes the connection was lost, and you couldn't reconnect either. W9x told the server was down. The Ubuntu box didn't have any problems. I don't know if the wireless was the problem or the 2nd router. Sometimes a file written from a W9x box became readonly for a W9x box, but not for W2000/Linux. This had something to do with the timestamp of the file. A simple 'touch' from the W2000 box made it writeable again.

I exchanged this NAS because the build-in scandisk reported errors without giving a way to repair it. A bit scary. Now I've got a ZyXEL NSA-220, which has a Raid1 array, and runs on Linux. I still have different usernames and passwords for the various shares, and it's still impossible for a W9x box to access a share with a different username. Further I haven't found any problems with the device. (Apart from spinning up without an obvious reason, but I don't think this is W9x related).

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Thank you for that response! I had a hard time nailing down what it was that *I* did before in that situation...

I was to the point of simply repeating every single step just because one of them was the one that made it work right.

Rolenet should be able to troubleshoot the issue now....

I gotta bookmark this for later...

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Thanks for the info and link.

My HD363N unit uses a RDC2881 chip (no USB), with firmware 007-1005.

Here's what I tried:

* using a blank drive formated in the NAS

* using a folder share NOT named "public"

* defining shares passwords (Btw cannot define SMB users on this box, only FTP)

* using FTP

* changing the device's clock

Result:

No cake. Everything works except copying from the NAS to the computer. There seem to be something timestamp related, most of the time recent files work, not old ones. But it's not that straightforward.

Also, opening JPEGs from the drive on ACDSee 2 displays gray bars at the bottom of 90% of the files. The files are not actually corrupted, though.

I'm giving up which is too bad because it works fine otherwise. If someone manages to make one of those cheap boxes work, praise tell us!

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You *could* try to find firmware from another vendor for the same chip. Of course this can brick your device. I don't know how interchangeble those firmware versions are. NAS-BASIC for the RDC 2882 chip seems to be no problem. Dennis serves firmware for the Conceptronic RDC 2882. In the comments I never read that another brand was incompatible. I flashed it to my Fantec. Alas he doesn't offer RDC 2881 firmware.

In this document you can find a list of RDC 2881 devices, which can lead you to their firmware, and some in-depth information about RDC 28xx devices.

Here is a long thread about the HD363N. I don't know if it contains something useful for you.

Edit: Maybe you could use NetDrive. It's freeware from Novell, which mounts an FTP share as driveletter. The RDC 28xx devices have a more robust FTP- than SMB server. Alas NetDrive is only usable when you use it with relatively small files. The implementation brings the whole file local when you access it. So opening big files will be slow, since the device does at max about 3 MB/s.

Edited by Mijzelf
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Thanks a lot Mijzelf.

I read the board thread you linked a few times in the past. Ito does not contain info pertinent viz. win9x.

But didn't know about those RDC chipset and firmware links, thanks!

You said you flashed your Fantec. But are you using it from a win98 computer, then, or something newer only?

(Btw my box is Inoi-branded. I saw that other brands do not cite win9x as compatible)

- thx

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I run almost always under Win98. I now have a good reliable NAS with access using Samba and FTP. Saves and retrieves files no problems. Can't think I did anything special except read the info that came with it.

Its predecessor was a different kettle of fish altogether. Although it claimed to do Samba and FTP, and even that it would do P2P for me, it kept on corrupting the disk. It laid claim to supporting a 400GB disk, so I fed it a 320 GB drive to keep well within its limits. But even so, give it 40 or 50 GB of backup, and 24 hours later it would be gone. It wasn't a problem with the disk as that is now reliably earning its keep in a different PC altogether.

So I think it all depends on the box itself whether they are reliable. Remember they are embedded computers within the box, and they are cheap. We know that cheap and reliable are often strangers, and rarely share the same bed.

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You said you flashed your Fantec. But are you using it from a win98 computer, then, or something newer only?
I'm not using it anymore. I had it in a W2000, 2xW98SE, W95osr2 and Linux network. It was workable, but I bought a new box because this one started reporting errors in the filesystem, without a way to repair them.
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Thanks!

"North of Watford", what NAS brand/model have you been using with success? (And while we're at it, the one which didn't work...)?

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what NAS brand/model have you been using with success? (And while we're at it, the one which didn't work...)?

For the one that works well, here is the closest that is still on the manufacturer's site:

http://www.a-tecsubsystem.com/websys/atec/...d=1191910612953

What I have is the IDE version, though as we know that disk format is going out of fashion at present. Maplin still have plenty on sale in the UK, they seem to have bought a job lot:

http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?Module...90&doy=27m7

I have a tendency to go for "trailing edge" technology, I'll leave all the "bleeding edge" stuff to someone else.

The ones that didn't work (I had two of them!) were NAS Drive Kit from ADS Tech. It is now consigned to their "legacy" list, what details there are can be seen at:

http://www.adstech.com/support/productsupp...S%20Drive%20Kit

Based on the performance of the two that I had, I am not in the least bit surprised that they are no longer in that market! In theory it was just what I needed. In practice an expensive door stop, even though I did get them at a "remainder" price.

Regards,

NW

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What I have is the IDE version, though as we know that disk format is going out of fashion at present. Maplin still have plenty on sale in the UK, they seem to have bought a job lot: url
This box seems identical to my Fantec.
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