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Gradius2

The Solution for Seagate 7200.11 HDDs

4,858 posts in this topic

Thanks for explaining...but It's not exactly "gone" yet since I still manage to sort of access it and check for bad clusters, even with delays... I've been using this tool http://hddguru.com/software/HDD-LLF-Low-Level-Format-Tool

Yep, that is a (incorrectly named) wiping tool, it basicaly attempts writing 00's to each and every sector.

But the disk is gone. :(

To explain the delays you get, it goes like that (more or less):

You (through the OS, the disk driver and the disk controller and the disk firmware) order the disk to read sector (say) 3289.

The disk tries it:

  1. Reading sector 3289 .... cannot read it!
  2. Trying again reading sector 3289 .... cannot read it!
  3. Loop to #2 n times until, by pure chance, it manages to read it, then:
  4. OK, sector 3289 read.

Additionally, each and every "loud click" you hear is the head completely failing to find a position on the disk and "going astray", a "stuck" head doesn't move (and hence the drive assembly doesn't click loud).

Usually stuck heads mean also disk not spinning (as normally a stuck head is stuck to the platter and prevents it from spinning up).

jaclaz

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Thanks for explaining...but It's not exactly "gone" yet since I still manage to sort of access it and check for bad clusters, even with delays... I've been using this tool http://hddguru.com/software/HDD-LLF-Low-Level-Format-Tool

Yep, that is a (incorrectly named) wiping tool, it basicaly attempts writing 00's to each and every sector.

But the disk is gone. :(

To explain the delays you get, it goes like that (more or less):

You (through the OS, the disk driver and the disk controller and the disk firmware) order the disk to read sector (say) 3289.

The disk tries it:

  1. Reading sector 3289 .... cannot read it!
  2. Trying again reading sector 3289 .... cannot read it!
  3. Loop to #2 n times until, by pure chance, it manages to read it, then:
  4. OK, sector 3289 read.

Additionally, each and every "loud click" you hear is the head completely failing to find a position on the disk and "going astray", a "stuck" head doesn't move (and hence the drive assembly doesn't click loud).

Usually stuck heads mean also disk not spinning (as normally a stuck head is stuck to the platter and prevents it from spinning up).

jaclaz

Alright, but just to clarify - it does spin and I attached the sound it makes most of the time. Is that it?

The really loud clicking may happen when running formatting or disk repair tools and only after reaching a certain spot at around 30%.

And if you're correct about this, then what exactly is broken there? Is it something that can be replaced? The heads maybe?

HDD.mp3

Edited by Calyps0
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Alright, but just to clarify - it does spin and I attached the sound it makes most of the time. Is that it?

Sure, that means that the head (actually head arm) is not stuck anywhere.

The really loud clicking may happen when running formatting or disk repair tools and only after reaching a certain spot at around 30%.

And if you're correct about this, then what exactly is broken there? Is it something that can be replaced? The heads maybe?

Yep, and again this means that the head cannot find what it is looking for and "goes" astray.

In your case it happens at around 30%, which on a multiplatter disk, can be a single head gone, or a side gone (actual platter surface - unlikely to happen without "carrying with it the head" as well) or the SA/firmware partially corrupted, no real way to know, and in any case NOT a DIY job, particularly on a Seagate 500 Gb or any multiplatter disk.

A 500 Gb disk (brand new) costs around 60-100 US $.

A professional repair (if possible) would likely go in the US$ 1000-2000 range.

The tools needed to repair go in the 5000-10000 US$ (without the NEEDED training, which will more than double that figure).

Hard as it may be, sometimes you need to call it a loss and go ahead.

jaclaz

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Alright, but just to clarify - it does spin and I attached the sound it makes most of the time. Is that it?

Sure, that means that the head (actually head arm) is not stuck anywhere.

Wait, so while it's not stuck - is there anything that can be done to make it read at least without those long intervals?

I understand it may seem pointless to try, but I'm still curious...

Also it's not 500GB, but 1.5 Tb.

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Wait, so while it's not stuck - is there anything that can be done to make it read at least without those long intervals?

Sure, professional repair. :angel

I understand it may seem pointless to try, but I'm still curious...

I would call you more "stubborn" than "curious", but that's OK. :)

Also it's not 500GB, but 1.5 Tb.

My bad :blushing: , consider the previous "60-100 US $" range as "80-120 US$" instead:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007603%20600003269%20600003316&IsNodeId=1&name=1.5TB

a dramatic 20-30% :w00t: increase that makes the option slightly less convenient ;).

jaclaz

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Wait, so while it's not stuck - is there anything that can be done to make it read at least without those long intervals?

Sure, professional repair. :angel

I understand it may seem pointless to try, but I'm still curious...

I would call you more "stubborn" than "curious", but that's OK. :)

Also it's not 500GB, but 1.5 Tb.

My bad :blushing: , consider the previous "60-100 US $" range as "80-120 US$" instead:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007603%20600003269%20600003316&IsNodeId=1&name=1.5TB

a dramatic 20-30% :w00t: increase that makes the option slightly less convenient ;).

jaclaz

Hm, I understand about "professionals" with their thousand dollar equipment and whatever training...but I prefer to try all possible ways first :D After doing a bit more research I'm fairly certain now that the heads are faulty and need cleaning http://www.soyouwanna.com/clean-head-hard-drive-26646.html

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Hm, I understand about "professionals" with their thousand dollar equipment and whatever training...but I prefer to try all possible ways first :D After doing a bit more research I'm fairly certain now that the heads are faulty and need cleaning http://www.soyouwanna.com/clean-head-hard-drive-26646.html

Yeah, sure :thumbup , with that set of instructions you are good to go.

Remember that you need unpowdered latex gloves ;) and a VERY "clean and dust-free room indoors", as a matter of fact you would actually need something like a small clean room, *like* the one hinted about here:

Good luck for the cleaning with compressed air *any* head on a multiplatter disk, and particularly those on non-first platter and the underside one of first platter :angel .

JFYI, and OT, last time I had a faulty piston on my car, it didn't start working after I cleaned it :(.

jaclaz

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last time I had a faulty piston on my car, it didn't start working after I cleaned it :(.

Oh duh, you obviously didn't use a clean garage and updated the firmware of the engine management :no:

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last time I had a faulty piston on my car, it didn't start working after I cleaned it :(.

Oh duh, you obviously didn't use a clean garage and updated the firmware of the engine management :no:

Oh, yes, I did, I also cleaned VERY thoroghfully both sides of the crack that divided the piston in two halves, really.

Still it didn't work. :(

jaclaz

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So ok, I'm gonna remove the heads first then. Got nothing to lose either way. I doubt condensed air would help though, perhaps I should use something else ?

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So ok, I'm gonna remove the heads first then.

Well, if you cannot afford a tool like the mentioned one:

http://forum.hddguru.com/viewtopic.php?t=17926&start=

At least get some "medicine blisters", at least Scott Moulton:

http://myharddrivedied.com/

can move heads with them:

(please remember to count the number of platters of the disks shown in the above video)

Got nothing to lose either way. I doubt condensed air would help though, perhaps I should use something else ?

Naaah, the air being "condensed" is the least of the issues here.

jaclaz

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Dear MSFN Users,

I have also some of these very awesome piece of sh** hard drives.. Now I have first swapped my PCB, but with a Firmware Swap. That means that I have my EEPROM chip resoldered to the new Board.

But then I noticed, it is not the Board maybe its the BSY Bug!

Soo.. Then I bought an CA-42 cable and followed this tutorial:

I noticed after that, nothing.. Still in the BIOS was shown nothing.. I pressed CTRL+ALT+DEL to restart and then abrakadabra.. There it is! (It is kinda confusing me so much) So I have boot it finally up. After a quite while, I noticed, that it was veryyyyyyyyyyyy slow! And then I thought it has stuck on the boot process, so I shut my PC down and start it again.. And then again, in the BIOS was nothing -.-

So after a quite while I noticed that thing here, the G-List step! So I tried the whole BSY fix with the commands in this thread again.. Still same s*** with BIOS and CTRL+ALT+DEL! Now it does not even boot, it stucks after a while and there is written an Windows 7 Boot Load Error! Then I thought hmm maybe some files are corrupt, let's try a Live-CD of Ubuntu! So it boot after a quite while finally up and the drive was also shown in Ubuntu but when I try to open it over Nautilus I get the Error: Cannot access on it because it is in use.. Or kinda like that error..

So I start again.. Searched and searched.. Nothing.. In the end I also tried that Tutorial again:

http://www.mapleleafmountain.com/seagatebrick.html

After that same problem.. Nothing happened... I'm quite tired.. I was sitting here now 6-7 hours just for fixing it.. The whole costs of the drive fixing were now on 50€! And still nothing.. I just want some files back.. Cannot I do anything else? Like upgrading the firmware or something else with the Hyperterminal?

Please help me..

Kind regards Arman! Sorry for my bad English, I'm German..

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Cannot I do anything else? Like upgrading the firmware or something else with the Hyperterminal?

Please help me..

The "basic error" (besides the various attempts you made - particularly erasing the G-list), is/was to assume that an unbricked disk:

  1. still has a perfectly functional filesystem
  2. can still boot a "complex" OS like a NT one as it did before the bricking

Both the above are gratuitious assumptions. :w00t:

The whole point is WHY did it "brick itself" originally, if it bricked because of the original issue with the log entry, then those assumptions may be correct, if it bricked itself for any other reason those are VERY unlikely to represent reality.

The only thing that you can do (and that you should have done BEFORE attempting booting from the disk :ph34r: and before attempting accessing files on it's filesystem) is to image the disk on another disk (you will need a slightly larger disk, NTFS formatted (if using Windows) or EXT3/4 formatted (if using Linux) or clone it to a similarly sized disk, surely functional.

You would normally use datarescuedd (Windows) or dd_rescue or ddrescue (Linux) and try to image the whole disk, if needed in "chunks".

Once the filesystem has been transferred (hopefully successfully and the whole of it) on a surely functional media, then you start attempting recovery of the filesystem (if possible) or recovery of the files in it (still as possible).

If you need help in doing the above, please start a new thread, as once the disk is not anymore BSY or LBA0, it exits the scope of the present thread.

jaclaz

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Hi, I think i've fried my drive now. :blushing: I got the loopback working on the replacement adapter and got as far as the m0,2,2,0,0,0,0,22, but I missed the last comme and wrote m0,2,2,0,0,0,022 which gave me an incorrect command warning. Now I can't access my drive on the hyperterminal, can't even get the CTRL-Z prompt to work. Should I start the process over again or would that make matters worse?

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Hi, I think i've fried my drive now. :blushing: I got the loopback working on the replacement adapter and got as far as the m0,2,2,0,0,0,0,22, but I missed the last comme and wrote m0,2,2,0,0,0,022 which gave me an incorrect command warning. Now I can't access my drive on the hyperterminal, can't even get the CTRL-Z prompt to work. Should I start the process over again or would that make matters worse?

Switch everything off (yes, physically remove power to everything, wait some sixty seconds before re-applying power, reboot the PC - just in case) and start again from scratch.

No harm should have been made.

BUT be very careful, and I mean VERY careful when you type commands (BEFORE pressing [ENTER] check, double check and triple check everything) this time you gave a non-existing command, but there are DESTRUCTIVE commands that are valid and that can botch the disk for good :ph34r: .

jaclaz

Edited by jaclaz
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Thanks for the info. How do I cancel an input if I have made a mistake? ESC? or ?

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Ok I did that and went throught the spin down and up and powered down and after a minute powered up again. The CTRL-Z returned a F3 T> as expected and then nothing. I can't enter m0,2,2,0,0,0,0,22 or do a CTRL-Z, no reaction from the hyperterminal. :(

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Thanks for the info. How do I cancel an input if I have made a mistake? ESC? or ?

Backspace? :unsure:

You cannot actually "cancel" an input, you can go back and overwrite it.

jaclaz

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Ok I did that and went throught the spin down and up and powered down and after a minute powered up again. The CTRL-Z returned a F3 T> as expected and then nothing. I can't enter m0,2,2,0,0,0,0,22 or do a CTRL-Z, no reaction from the hyperterminal. :(

Re-check everything (wires, connections, hypereterminal settings, etc.).

If you get to the F3 T> it means that it connected (and later from what you describe it seems like it lost connection).

jaclaz

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It worked!!! Brilliant!! :D :D :whistle: :whistle: :thumbup :thumbup

I can't thank you guys enough you've saved my bacon. Data is being copied while I type.

It would appear that patience is required on a job like this. I just waited and eventually I was able to enter data, weird.

All my wife's collages and designs are saved, she is overjoyed. (http://de.dawanda.com/shop/HelgaBerrillDesign?q=helgaberrilldesign)

Once again jaclaz thanks for your help, without you and the Canadian guy I would have been lost.

Chris

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Is it worth updating the firmware? I followed the link to it and downloaded the .exe and the iso. Am I right in thinking that I can just start the .exe and things will happen intuitively as long as I point to the right disc? Or is it better to use the iso? I am using a laptop and the sick drive was in a Seagate external drive.

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It worked!!! Brilliant!! :D

I can't thank you guys enough you've saved my bacon. Data is being copied while I type.

No prob :), glad to have contributed to another happy bunny in the basket:

It would appear that patience is required on a job like this. I just waited and eventually I was able to enter data, weird.

All my wife's collages and designs are saved, she is overjoyed. (http://de.dawanda.com/shop/HelgaBerrillDesign?q=helgaberrilldesign)

Once again jaclaz thanks for your help, without you and the Canadian guy I would have been lost.

Well, since your wife is a designer, I may ask you/her a happy bunny image to celebrate the success? :unsure:

About firmware, the bootable .iso is ALWAYS better (not because it is a .iso but because it provides a "simple", "clean" DOS environment).

Cannot say if the .iso will work "as is" with an external disk, though (I actually doubt it), possibly in your case you are forced to use the .exe from your running Windows, BUT what the thingy seemingly does (at least one of the version I saw) is to actually add a (tinycore) Linux to your system through some GRUB2 and - without having tested it - I wouldn't personally run that .exe on a "production machine".

Still personally, I would postpone the firmware updating until you can have a "normal" PC with that hard disk directly connected to it and run the .iso..

After all, the worse that can happen with the old firmware is that the drive bricks itself again, and you now know how to unbrick it.

jaclaz

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No designer bunnies yet but here are two to keep you going, thanks again for your help. :thumbup

post-378094-0-11668000-1369331991_thumb.

post-378094-0-55832900-1369332006_thumb.

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Cannot I do anything else? Like upgrading the firmware or something else with the Hyperterminal?

Please help me..

The "basic error" (besides the various attempts you made - particularly erasing the G-list), is/was to assume that an unbricked disk:

  1. still has a perfectly functional filesystem
  2. can still boot a "complex" OS like a NT one as it did before the bricking

Both the above are gratuitious assumptions. :w00t:

The whole point is WHY did it "brick itself" originally, if it bricked because of the original issue with the log entry, then those assumptions may be correct, if it bricked itself for any other reason those are VERY unlikely to represent reality.

The only thing that you can do (and that you should have done BEFORE attempting booting from the disk :ph34r: and before attempting accessing files on it's filesystem) is to image the disk on another disk (you will need a slightly larger disk, NTFS formatted (if using Windows) or EXT3/4 formatted (if using Linux) or clone it to a similarly sized disk, surely functional.

You would normally use datarescuedd (Windows) or dd_rescue or ddrescue (Linux) and try to image the whole disk, if needed in "chunks".

Once the filesystem has been transferred (hopefully successfully and the whole of it) on a surely functional media, then you start attempting recovery of the filesystem (if possible) or recovery of the files in it (still as possible).

If you need help in doing the above, please start a new thread, as once the disk is not anymore BSY or LBA0, it exits the scope of the present thread.

jaclaz

Dear jaclaz,

thank you for your answer! Seems like you are the only person who is still helping in this thread! Maybe I should explain what happened first.. On a night I turned off my computer... In the next day I came back home and whoops, my drive was not shown in BIOS! And then everything happened like I wrote earlier.. Now back to my drive.. The main confusing part is that, first my drive will not shown in the bios (everytime) but when I restart over CTRL+ALT+DEL than it will shown up.. I really don't understand that.. And now I started the other drive, which is working.. But in the device manager is not shown any other drive.. What now? I really don't know what to do.. Please help! Thanks much!

Kind regards Arman!

Edited by arman95
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The main confusing part is that, first my drive will not shown in the bios (everytime) but when I restart over CTRL+ALT+DEL than it will shown up.. I really don't understand that.. And now I started the other drive, which is working.. But in the device manager is not shown any other drive.. What now? I really don't know what to do.. Please help! Thanks much!

The issue generally speaking is that the BIOS "interrogates" the hard disk at boot time (or reboot with CTRL+ALT+DEL) and the disk should reply with some info.

If it is in BSY state (or any other of a list of issues) the hard disk does not reply and the BIOS does not see it.

In some cases, for *whatever* reason, an "unbricked" disk foes not show in BIOS but is found if connected to a running system through an USB adapter (or viceversa, it is seen in BIOS but not through the USB adapter).

It is possible that - again for *whatever* reasons that the disk is very slow in replying to the interrogation and thus it is recognized only once every n boots or it is recognized only if you do a CTRL+ALT+DEL immediately after having initiated booting (or do it several times).

As I see it the only possibilty is to try again and when you manage to get it recognised dd it's contents to a new disk.

Once the data (or as much data as possible) will be residing on a fully working disk, then attempt recovering it.

If you look a bit around in this forum:

http://www.msfn.org/board/forum/169-hard-drive-and-removable-media-issues/

you will find quite a few similar cases, some successful :), some failed :(, of this approach, so that you get an idea of the things that need to be done.

jaclaz

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