Gradius2

The Solution for Seagate 7200.11 HDDs

4,868 posts in this topic

Does the board react (do you get the debug prompt back) when you press CTR+Z again?

No, I don't get the debug prompt back after the hangup, I have to disconnect the terminal and back in to make Ctrl+z work.

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Hey Guys,

my drive isn't detected by the bios anymore.

And i still have this. (Only the adapter/cable at "Accessories").

Aurel Rs232-TTL

Will this work? Sorry for not having any better datasheet.

Greetings,

Zeemi

Edited by Zeemi
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Hey Guys,

my drive isn't detected by the bios anymore.

And i still have this. (Only the adapter/cable at "Accessories").

Aurel Rs232-TTL

Will this work? Sorry for not having any better datasheet.

Greetings,

Zeemi

NO :(, I don't think it will work.

That module has 0-5V TTL levels (TTL-CMOS):

http://www.aurelwireless.com/downloads/manuali-uso/650200625G_mu.pdf

You want one with 3.3v TTL levels (TTL), reference:

http://www.interfacebus.com/voltage_threshold.html

jaclaz

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The voltage levels *shouldn't* be a problem; I resurrected my drive with

a standard MAX232 (=5V TTL) driver and it worked as planned.

(BTW: I don't know who proved that one needs a 3.3V TTL driver; I don't

have an oscilloscope anymore to check that statement myself...) :unsure:

Greetz,

Peter.

Edited by VideoRipper
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Well, looks like it works, thanks guys! :D

Quick question- does this prevent the issue recurring with the fixed drives, or do they still need the firmware 'update' from Seagate, or should I just copy the data off and get rid of the entire drive?

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It's a known firmware issue, so you will get the same problems after another

320 log entries if you stick to the SD15 firmware. :angry:

I think you should get rid of the drive, if possible:

  • Backup the drive (at least the most important stuff)
  • Download and burn SeaTools for DOS to a CD-R
  • Reboot your PC from the CD-ROM (with the drive attached)
  • Do a short- and a long-DST test
    --------------- SeaTools for DOS v2.17 ---------------

    Device 0 is Seagate Device ST3500320AS 9QM22HVN On Intel ICH5
    Max Native Address 976773167
    Device is 48 Bit Addressed - Number of LBAs 976773167 ( 500.108 GB )
    This drive supports Security Features
    SMART Is Supported And ENABLED
    SMART Has NOT Been Tripped
    DST Is Supported
    Logging Feature Set Is Supported
    POH 5994 Current Temp 23

    Started Short DST 2/12/2010 @ 11:37.4
    DST -- FAILED - Read Element LBA = 0
    Your SeaTools Test Code: A7E7D56A
    Short DST FAILED 2/12/2010 @ 11:37.16


  • When you get an error-code like above (A7E7D56A), write it down and
    create an RMA at Seagate to have it swapped using the error-code.
  • If you don't get an error-code (which I doubt) and you want to keep on
    using the drive, do the firmware update.
    ...but I do think you *should* swap it either way...

Greetz,

Peter.

Edited by VideoRipper
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(BTW: I don't know who proved that one needs a 3.3V TTL driver; I don't

Now you know:

http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?showtopic=128807&st=2338

The point is that, even if the interface "understands" TTL/CMOS (which I doubt), a 3.3V will work anyway, whilst a 4.8V will be understood as a "suffusion of yellow".

I don't think anyone has actually documented the EXACT signals level the HD actually "understands", though.

jaclaz

Edited by jaclaz
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Not really evidence, but thanks Jaclaz :)

My theory was that you can find out the correct needed TTL-level by measuring

the levels on the TX-line of the drive (with an oscilloscope, a multimeter would

be too slow); if it sends you 3.3V it must expect 3.3V as well.

Ah well... in my experience 5V TTL works just as well and it helped me out ;)

Greetz,

Peter.

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Not really evidence, but thanks Jaclaz :)

The matter is really confusing.

Let's try not to confuse further ideas, let's assume that there is no such thing as 5V TTL, but rather that there is:

  • TTL/CMOS which is 5V
  • TTL which is 3.3V

http://www.interfacebus.com/voltage_threshold.html

The fact that the chip used is a MAX232 doesn't necessarily imply that the output will be at TTL/CMOS levels, see here for a series of examples:

http://www.panuworld.net/nuukiaworld/hardware/cables/basics.htm

http://www.panuworld.net/nuukiaworld/hardware/cables/old.htm

http://www.panuworld.net/nuukiaworld/hardware/cables/fbus.htm

The Nokia cables use TTL 3.3v, and NOT 5V.

This is how I understand the issue (not necessarily right :ph34r: ).

Case #1:

Disk using TTL

Adapter using TTL

Everything "speaks" the same language, and everything is OK.

Case #2:

Disk using TTL/CMOS

Adapter using TTL/CMOS

Everything "speaks" the same language, and everything is OK.

Case #3:

Disk using TTL/CMOS

Adapter using TTL

If the drive is working with TTL/CMOS levels, it will understand anyway the 3.3v signals sent to it's receiver through the 3.3v TTL adapter TX line, and will send back to the adapter a 5V one, that the adapter's receiver may:

  1. "flatten" to 3.3V max and understand
  2. get it at 5V and don't understand it

Case #4:

Disk using TTL

Adapter using TTL/CMOS

If the drive is working with TTL levels, when the TTL/CMOS sends a 5V signal, hard disk's receiver may:

  1. "flatten" to 3.3V max and understand
  2. get it at 5V and don't understand it

The hard disk's transmitter will send a 3.3V signal that the TTL adapter will understand anyway.

Case #5:

As often happens with "standards", they are mainly b***sh** and noone actually respects them so a given adaprter works with the hard disk and another one doesn't, and noone knows until he actually tries it.

Without knowing the specifications for the Seagate disk, we are in this situation:

  • TTL interfaces (3.3V) will work ALWAYS if they can "flatten" the hypothetical higher level signal from the hard disk
  • TTL/CMOS interfaces may or may not work

Anyone is free to choose an adapter and trying it, of course. :)

If ANYWHERE (meaning either on the hard disk side or on the adapter's side) there are the two pulling down 2.7v or 3v zener diodes (or some other "peak pulling down" circuit):

http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?showtopic=128807&st=2645

anything will do, as anything between hard disk and adapter will be within TTL levels.

The number of people that (after having been very lucky and found the "right" Nokia cable or bought a bunch of them before finding the right one) had success with the Nokia cable make me think that we are in case #1 (or in #5 :whistle:), though it is very possible that those that had problems with the original "auto-switching" adapter simply had "something else" going wrong, but I find it unprobable that a "good" adapter as the one originally used has this kind of problems:

http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=449

RS232 Shifter SMD

sku: PRT-00449

Description: The smallest and easiest to use serial conversion circuit on the market! This board has one purpose in life - to convert RS232 to TTL and vice versa (TX and RX). This will allow a microcontroller to communicate with a computer. Shifter SMD is powered from the target application and can run at any voltage! That's right - power the board at 5V and the unit will convert RS232 to 5V TTL. Power the board at 2.8V and the Shifter board will convert RS232 to 2.8V CMOS TTL. Includes two indicator LEDs for TX and RX. Runs from 300bps up to 115200bps.

Please note how the terms appear reversed :w00t: from what the reference shows:

http://www.interfacebus.com/voltage_threshold.html

from other sources, it seems to me like this latter is accurate and the peeps at sparkfun completely missed the point.

However, the mistery remains....:unsure:, the good news :) are that there shouldn't be any harm done if the hard disk gets a "full" 5V signal level, so, at the most it won't work, but there should be no risk in trying it.

jaclaz

Edited by jaclaz
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Hi,

New here, found this site when looking up the "not recognised" 7200.11 problem. I have checked on the Seagate page, and while my drive is listed by model and serial number, my disk firmware is LC11, rather than the AD/SD group. I see in Gradius's post (19 Jan 2009) that the Seagate site says -

"**Note: If your drive has CC or LC firmware, your drive is not affected and no further action is required. Attempting to flash the firmware of a drive with CC or LC firmware will result in rendering your drive inoperable"

I cannot see this note on Seagate's site now (have they discovered otherwise?), and on 22 Jan 2009 (post #142) SPOOX repaired his drive - which had firmware LC15.

I am reading page by page and have got to page 37 - but can anyone tell me (sooner) if LC11 drives can be fixed this way? The problem does appear to be the BSY fault; the drive had been working perfectly normally until just one day on booting up, the drive was not recognised in BIOS. It has been tested in other computers; still not recognised.

If it can be revived, is there any updated LC firmware - and if so, would it be worth upgrading anyway?

Thanks in advance for any advice and help,

Gram

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Just stopping by say thanks, got my 500gb 7200.11 working again after it got stuck in BSY state following a power cut last year. :)

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You don't actually have to update the drive's firmware to enable access to it again.

Although I can't substantiate this, I think it's *relatively* safe to perform a SMART-erase

(level 1> N1), followed by a partition regeneration (level T> m0,2,2,,,,,22).

This *in theory* would unlock your drive from its BSY-state.

A firmware update is only necessairy to prevent this same thing happening again in the future,

after 320 log-entries (though you should try to get rid of the drive if possible).

But maybe jaclaz (or someone else) can eleborate on this? :unsure:

So before you do anything, wait until someone else comes along (or just do it if you're bold

enough) ;)

Greetz,

Peter.

Edited by VideoRipper
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Hello!

first post gah-

well i've been reading this thread for quite some time now and finally i'm trying to fix my seagate(BSY error thingie), but i have some problems :(..

first i use a nokia ca-42 cable, like in this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=29FztWJVxbM

figured would be easiest...

well...

my ca-42 cable however has 5 wires

black

blue

white

yellow

red

i tried it 2 days now to connect it succesfully and the ONLY combination i found is (pcb facing up)

red,black,white,blue

with this combination ctrl+z works, else just nothing or garbage letters!

BUT with this combination the cable i'm using only get's recognised by the pc if the pcb board is disconnected, once i'm at the part where you reconnect the pcb and turn off the drive, after 10 seconds on again the cable won't be recognised anymore! just nothing... ctrl+z won't work and i can't put in the m0,2,2,,,,,22 command

if the pcb board is connected i can get the cable to "work" with this combination (again pcb facing up)

something,black,red,something...

it get's recognised just by having black and red in it.. tho if i cange them up (like in the combination with the pcb disconnected) it won't recognise the cable again... and every combination with black,red in the middle in hyperterminal shows nothing or garbage letters(crtl+z won't work too)

anyone any ideas what else i can try?

i'm sorry if this(thing) was asked already but i didn't know what to search for(and i only read a small portion of this HUGE thread after all..)

also sorry for my english , i'm german

edit(like the 6 time..): just read the first post again.. because of frustration i tried once to not power it down and back up again but just put in the m0,2,2,,,,,22 command... with nothing happening i turned the whole thing off... i thought "yea i didn't turn it off before.. ofcouse it won't work :(*unplugs powercable* " ... guess that's it already isn't it? the hdd is useless? :(

edit again.. couldnt take my hands of it, tried to get the cable recognised with pcb connected again.. and.. for some strange reason now it's recognised with red,black,nothing,nothing... wich..didn't..work..before...totally confused..well..

edito... i've run it again, everythings fine.. until i powered off, powered on, cable gone... (like before, red black white blue)hows that freakin possible, an edit before it recognised the cable with the pcb connected with red on first slot, now after it's powered on again i have to put red to slot 3, and if i do that hyperterminal won't do anything .. with like...

nothing,black,red,white/blue/yellow...

get you guys all confused with my edits too >.<

ediiit: tried something different , put red on+ black on- of 3v battery, connected blue and white on tx and rx ... got an -> (small arrow) on hyperterminal, switched tx and rx... and.. again.. small arrow.. hm

Edited by Eaglemania
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Go to p. 131 and see my post and the pictures to see if you can see what color wires you need. You only need 3 of them, not 4. Hopefully you can make the necessary correlation to the correct wires to your CA-42 cable. How are you connecting the cable wires to the actual HDD? I hope you are using some jumper pins or something like that to make a firm connection. Let me know if the pictures are of any help.

Hello!

i tried it 2 days now to connect it succesfully and the ONLY combination i found is (pcb facing up)

red,black,white,blue

with this combination ctrl+z works, else just nothing or garbage letters!

BUT with this combination the cable i'm using only get's recognised by the pc if the pcb board is disconnected, once i'm at the part where you reconnect the pcb and turn off the drive, after 10 seconds on again the cable won't be recognised anymore! just nothing... ctrl+z won't work and i can't put in the m0,2,2,,,,,22 command

Edited by mundy5
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i'm using crimp pins i salvaged out of an old uhm.. IDE ..to.. PCIe? power supply cable, they fit so-so, but i squeezed each a little, so now they fit pretty decent i believe (also don't unplug that easily) when i connect it with black for ground white blue for tx/rx the ca-42 cable doesn't show up in the hardware manager(i believe it's called..well, maybe) and i can't call the com (won't even show up, only if i put black and red on the drive or on battery)

and if i do put black and red on the drive so the cable atleast... shows up on my pc , everything i try as 3rd cable yea does nothing in hyperterminal or just gives garbage letters

also the usb side of my ca-42 is in some metal casing ... (originally blue rubber around that..) so i can't see the connections there

Edited by Eaglemania
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