[duffy98]

I go to YouTube a few times a week or every other week or so ... today this message was on the web page in relation to me being there using Internet Explorer 6.

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We will be phasing out support for your browser soon.
Please upgrade to one of these more modern browsers.

Google Chrome ... Firefox 3.5 ... Internet Explorer 8

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I had never seen this this message before, it may have been on the web page but today I did notice it. This is something I hadn't given much thought too ... keeping Windows 98SE "modern" in today's world is one thing but what can a person do if other web sites also start dropping IE 6 or other browsers that still work with Windows 98SE.

Those browsers mentioned by YouTube do not work with Windows 98SE or 98 in general.

***
Some further info concerning IE 6 .... I just went to this web site and they also read my browser as IE 6 and this message was displayed ...

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Still using IE6?! Did you know that your security is at risk using IE6? Did you know many sites — including Lottery Post — will stop supporting IE6 this year?

You really need to upgrade right away. It is simple and free — let us show you how.

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This seems to be something that is going to happen sooner than later ... What modern browser would have future access to these web sites that would work with Windows 98SE? I will keep using IE 6 till these sites start refusing me ... maybe they will have a tab or work around for older browsers ... this is all new to me. Open to suggestions. Thanks ....

This post has been edited by dencorso: 13 November 2009 - 01:57 PM
Reason for edit: Updated the title and added subtitle pointing to solution.

[herbalist]

YouTube is reading the user agent string reported by your browser. That message is there when I allowed IE6 to send a proper user string. When I block or spoof the user agent, the message disappears. That message isn't there when I used SeaMonkey or K-Meleon. Both of them are current 9X compatible browsers.

Websites are like software installers. Some introduce artificial incompatibilities based on what OS or browser they detect. Spoofing or blocking the user agent may be sufficient, just like removing the artificial incompatibility in an installer. For right now, we still have 9X browsers. KernelEX makes it possible to use newer ones. Beyond that, it depends on what the site changes and if there will be any real incompatibility.

[duffy98]

herbalist .... thanks for the info .... may I ask, if it's not too time consuming or hard to explain, how can I do the same thing ... block or spoof the user agent in IE 6. I have heard of those two browsers (Sea Monkey / K-Melon) and have them downloaded somewhere. I will get the latest versions of each to have on hand but if I could block or spoof the user agent in IE 6, as you did, then maybe I could keep using IE 6 into the future.

I also update IE 6 with "Maximus Decim InternetExplorer 6.0sp1 Component Update 2.7" , as they are released and IE 6 works very good for me at this time.

[ldb]

I personally dislike IE 6 as it is slow and does not always load the entire page. I use Firefox 2.0.0.20 and visited You Tube earlier and saw no such warning. Another thing, you can download a user agent switcher that adds into the tools so you can spoof the website. I was not using it when I went to You Tube.

[BenoitRen]

IE6 is very old and should die already. In comparison with more recent web browsers, it has bad web standards support.

Not to mention the thing is unstable, insecure, and sucks your resources dry after a while.

You can use Firefox 2.0.0.20, SeaMonkey 1.1.17, the latest K-Meleon 1.1.x, or the latest Opera. Plenty of choice.

[herbalist]

Quote

how can I do the same thing ... block or spoof the user agent in IE 6.

I believe there's a registry tweak that can do that for IE6 but I don't know what it is. My preference is to let Proxomitron alter the headers. Proxomitron can modify the user agent string and most any other web content of anything that connects to the web through it.
 Prox_user_agent.gif (111.95K)
Number of downloads: 22
I'm finding Proxomitron to be more and more useful. It can filter out or modify undesirable or troublesome web content, remove ads, filter out malicious code, and much more. It's a small, lightweight program that you unzip and use. It can be looked at as a rule based content filter. More info on Proxomitron is available at The Un-Official Proxomitron Forum.

[duffy98]

herbalist ... I use Proxomitron also with the latest Sidki filter set. I am in the process of downloading Firefox v2.0.0.20 now to try out. Yes, I think that IE 6 does seem slow to load a web page sometimes. Ok, so I will have Sea Monkey, K-Melon and Firefox v2.0.0.20 to work with ... anyone know for sure which one might be really low on resource use or are they all close? I have an old 98SE Toshiba notebook that I will test the three that I mentioned above. If I go with anyone of those three, can I then remove IE 6 completly from my computer or does it also have to remain on the computer, even if it will no longer be used? ... thanks Idb and BenoitRen also for your input.

This post has been edited by duffy98: 25 July 2009 - 11:03 AM

[herbalist]

The filter I mentioned is part of Proxomitron's default filter set. You could save a copy of your existing filterset, reload the originals, then copy that particular filter if you want.

I can't comment on FireFox but both SeaMonkey and K-Meleon work very well on old systems. Both are faster and lighter. My system is a 366MHZ Celeron with 160MB RAM, and it will run for several days using them before needing a reboot. It couldn't do that using IE6.

[duffy98]

thanks for the Proxomitron info ... I decided not to download Sea Monkey ... it is a - 13 MB download where K-melon and Firefox are both under 6 MB. ... herbalist, do you still have IE on your computer in any form ? ... or can it be completely removed. I have a program that will completely remove IE but should it be completely removed for Windows 98SE?

[herbalist]

SeaMonkey is bigger because it's a full browser suite while FF and K-Meleon are browsers only. SeaMonkey includes an e-mail/newsgroup component that replaces OE very nicely, with an integrated address book, a webpage composer that works quite well, and an IRC chat component. You can choose what components you want installed.

IE6 can be removed using IEradicator. You can also use 98lite and not install it to begin with. The preview version will remove IE. The paid version can do that and much more. My 98FE unit still has IE6, as does some of my 98 test units. My regular 98SE unit does not. I also have a 98FE test unit with IE removed that runs circles around the others.

IEradicator leaves a couple of files that aren't there when 98lite is used. Removing IE will break some software that uses IE components. Quite often that can be fixed by adding the specific file the app needs instead of installing the whole IE package. When an app breaks, Dependency Walker can show you what file it needs. Often that file can be put in the apps own folder. Removing IE will make the OS faster, lighter, and in many cases, more stable. On a couple of occasions, I have had to dig up a specific IE file to make an app work, but it's not that big of a deal as long as you have copies of the files.

As far as removing IE goes, it depends on what you need, as long as you're aware that it can break some apps. Just make a system backup before you try it. You can always reinstall IE6. I'd save a copy of the installer first.

[dencorso]

For anyone having problems with YouTube or the like, here is a simple way to change the user agent sent by IE6, using only the registry. In the attached file there are three .reg files: if you merge regIE8Vi.reg to your registry, IE6 will tell all sites it is IE8, runing on Vista; if you, instead, merge regIE7XP.reg to your registry, IE6 will duly tell all sites it is IE7, runing on XP. Don't forget to reverse the change, afterwards, by merging regback.reg to your registry, to remove the spoof, as some sites (like Windows Updates, for instance) need to know your true settings to work right. Of course, it all can be automated by means of batch files. There is no need to reboot, all you have to do is close all IE6 windows, merge the appropriate .reg, then reopen IE6 for it to work.

Later edit: Original version removed. Download instead the updated version from post #148.

This post has been edited by dencorso: 13 November 2009 - 01:37 PM
Reason for edit: Added link to the updated version.

[Dude112]

ldb, on Jul 25 2009, 12:17 PM, said:

I personally dislike IE 6 as it is slow and does not always load the entire page.

I personally like IE6 better than any other IE version!!

I think its stupid all these websites are killing off IE6 access,totally shows a laziness on thier part to keep the coding going for it.. (That seems to be the trend )

[duffy98]

dencorso .... thanks for the IE6 registry fix. I have decided to go that route for now, that's really good, this forum always comes through with help and good ideas. I agree with Dude112 ... I like IE6 and would like to stay with it for as long as possible. I know sometimes I have a web page that loads slow but I am never sure if it might be because of Proxomitron since it is filtering so many things out ... also I connect through my cell phone ... when I got the phone and mobile office kit in 2004, connections and everything (web pages) were pretty fast but as more people started texting, sending photos, downloading tv shows, movies or whatever ... I have noticed a drop in speed at certain times when I am on the internet. It's like I am waiting for "my turn" somewhere, but in general the speed is usually pretty good .... so a web page will open slow sometimes for me ... but it may not be completely the fault of IE6.

... I will still check out one of the other browsers as a possible "backup" browser to just have handy.

*** update: I used the patch regIE7XP.reg and tried the two sites again. Does work ! ... no messages about IE6 being phased out. ... thanks again

This post has been edited by duffy98: 26 July 2009 - 06:39 AM

[BenoitRen]

"Dude112" said:

I think its stupid all these websites are killing off IE6 access,totally shows a laziness on thier part to keep the coding going for it.. (That seems to be the trend)

There's a very good reason for this trend. Do you know about web standards? They're standards agreed upon by a wide range of people from all around the world, specifying HTML, CSS, how a web page should be rendered, and other web technologies.

When you make a web page, you conform to these standards, and the web browser, in turn, renders your page according to these standards. The idea is that every web browser would show each web page in an almost identical way, instead of having to make separate web pages for each web browser, or, $DEITY forbid, make your web page for only one web browser.

Enter IE. As of IE5, IE implements several parts of the standard wrongly, most notably the box model. In IE6, they fixed the box model, and then stalled development for 5 years, which sucked, because it is lacking support for many parts of the CSS and DOM standards, and notable parts of the HTML standard. It also has a lot of rendering bugs.

In the meantime, other web browsers have released new versions like hotcakes, and vastly exceeded IE6's web standards support. So much so that these days when you make a new web page that separates content from style, it looks great in every web browser... except IE. A lot of work and many hacks are required just to make it look good in IE without breaking it for the others because of all the bugs in that thing.

Do you understand now why IE6 is such a pain in the behind for web developers?!

[herbalist]

Even if IE6 rendered the pages perfectly, there's plenty of other problems. Of all the 9X compatible browsers, IE6 wastes the most resources. The longer it runs, the less available resources you have until it reaches the point that your system becomes unstable. Closing IE6 does not get them back. You have to reboot. With SeaMonkey and K-Meleon, you get back most of those resources when you close the browser or even a few tabs. 9X systems leave something to be desired when it comes to resource management. Until such a time that someone finds a way to fix the problem at the source (the OS itself) keeping a 9X system stable requires using software that makes efficient use of those limited resources. Most MS software does not.

Then there's the security issue. IE6 is a 9X systems biggest vulnerability. It was also responsible for a large percentage of the patches on XP. IE6 is the single most exploited application for Windows. Because of its integration with the OS, attacks on IE6 usually result in the OS itself being compromised. I still have IE6 on a couple of the operating systems here, but I will not let it connect to the web without running it through Proxomitron. With SeaMonkey and K-Meleon, Proxomitron serves primarily as an annoyance remover, banner ads, Google links, etc. Used with IE6, it's a primary defense.

Quote

I know sometimes I have a web page that loads slow but I am never sure if it might be because of Proxomitron since it is filtering so many things out ... also I connect through my cell phone ... when I got the phone and mobile office kit in 2004, connections and everything (web pages) were pretty fast but as more people started texting, sending photos, downloading tv shows, movies or whatever ... I have noticed a drop in speed at certain times when I am on the internet.

I'd be inclined to believe that your cellphone connection is the primary culprit here. The amount of processor power that Proxomitron uses to filter out items is less than a browser would use to render the same items. I've always found that Proxomitron speeds up the apparent web speed by keeping unwanted content from loading.

[duffy98]

OK ... I hear ya herbalist. You and many (most) others are much more in the know than I am on this IE 6 subject. You mentioned the browsers you like ... others mentioned Firefox 2.0.0.20. I have them all downloaded ... I'd like something that is safe, simple, fast and low on resource use. I came across these two additional browsers that work with Windows 98SE and was wondering if anyone reading this thread has tried them or might be using them now ....


TheWorld Browser for Windows 98 v2.4.1.2 (2009-06-04)

http://www.ioage.com/en/

http://www.ioage.com/en/download.htm

http://www.brothersoft.com/theworld-browse...-98-111697.html


and ...

SlimBrowser v4.12 released, Jul 23, 2009

Windows 98+IE5 is the minimum requirement. SlimBrowser runs on both 32-bit and 64-bit windows platform.

http://www.flashpeak.com/sbrowser/


they are both very small downloads.

This post has been edited by duffy98: 26 July 2009 - 03:35 PM

[duffy98]

crisp ... thanks for the info on those two browsers. So you are saying I would have no security to speak of with those two browsers. All these years I've only used Internet Explorer ... starting with version 4. Not very familiar with any of the other browsers ... I will try the ones that herbalist mentioned and any that are mentioned in the future.

[herbalist]

I don't know if they're still available, but there used to be themes for FireFox and the Mozilla Suite (the original name for SeaMonkey) including one that made them look very much like Internet Explorer. It made things easier for users who weren't comfortable with changing browsers. There's also some very nice extensions for both of them. They can both be customized to suit your needs.

K-Meleon is an extremely configurable browser. If you like tweaking settings, it's got tweaks for everything. It has built in flash blocking, user agent spoofing, proxy switching, one click clearing of all usage records, and much more. A fair amount of what I had Proxomitron doing is built into K-Meleon. It takes a little more getting used to than SeaMonkey but it's more flexible.

I originally switched to the Mozilla Suite for the improved security. The improved handling of resources was a pleasant surprise, but the thing I've come to appreciate the most is tabbed browsing. Instead of having multiple Windows open, it's multiple tabs in a single window. It's so much more convenient than working with multiple open Windows. I'm amazed at how long it took MS to copy the idea. They finally did in IE7.

K-Meleon is also available as a zip file. I think SeaMonkey might be too. If you don't want to install either, you can try the zipped versions. Just unzip it and go.

Someone else will have to comment on Opera and FireFox. It's been a long time since I've tried either one. The last time I used FireFox, it was called Firebird.