[JorgeA]

dencorso, on 15 April 2010 - 12:03 AM, said:

The screenshots are quite good. Let's see what turns out. Meanwhile, have you run SFC.EXE already? If not, do it and report, please.

Hello dencorso,

I ran SFC.exe as you asked. I don't recall ever doing that before, so I'm not sure what to look for, but the program didn't ask to replace any files. (Do I have it right that it will ask to do that, if it finds a corrupted file?)

A few files had a "No" result for the CRC Match, but they didn't seem to cause SFC.exe to burp. They were:
EXPLORER.EXE
SYSTRAY.EXE
USER.EXE
BATMETER.DLL
POWRPROF.DLL
USER32.DLL
mapi32.DLL
DISKTSD.VXD
IOS.VXD

Any thoughts?

--JorgeA

[JorgeA]

supem, on 15 April 2010 - 03:08 PM, said:

JorgeA,
I would recommend to try "heap extender" http://www.msfn.org/...er-t136171.html smart piece of soft by Tihiy developed one year ago unfortunately not completed yet

Hello supem,

Thanks for the link.

I read the whole thread, and as you point out it looks like the software isn't quite ready for prime time yet. I've got enough stuff to deal with already!

Plus, as a newbie here it looks like I have to get up to speed on Win98 innovations at MSFN. Don't know what RP9 (Revolutions Pack?) is, will have to check it out.

Tell you one thing -- I wish I'd discovered this forum years ago!! Probably would have saved me a ton of time and frustration.

--JorgeA

[rilef]

I checked my memory usage during another Spybot scan. Memory usage was an acceptable 45% to 48%, apx 62 Mb, of which apx 53 Mb was attributable to Spybot. (Memory was obtained by right-clicking the My Computer icon, and selecting Properties and then the Performance tab. Spybot memory usage was computed by taking memory usage at startup (apx 93% free or 7% usage), and deducting this amount from memory usage when Spybot was running). My suspicion is that, while memory usage (and number of file set items scanned) may dramatically affect the speed of the scan, memory usage is not the cause of the computer crashes and freezes being discussed.

I next visited the Spybot user forum website (A very active and informative forum, it appears). No recent memory issues were noted. But there were several posts relating to the fact that Spybot is very CPU intensive. Of particular note was criticism of two real-time Spybot processes (SDHelper and TeaTimer) as resource hogs. I have not installed either of these Spybot features on my computer, so I can't comment on the criticism. But users with Spybot-related crash and freeze problems should consider disabling or uninstalling these Spybot features, if they haven't already done so. Then run a Spybot scan again to see if this fixes the problems.

Spybot has a number of settings that may increase CPU usage, especially at the end of scans when computer crashes and freezes seem to be occurring (see Advanced Mode, Settings menu). I have deselected all items from the settings menu, except for "Save all settings" and "Display confirmation dialogs before doing critical changes". I don't have Spybot produce bug reports, log reports, or other reports; or create backups and restore points; or run at startup and other automated procedures. Instead, I find that Spybot finds at most a handful of suspected spyware items (usually none), and these few items can be best disposed of manually. Users with Spybot-related crash and freeze problems should consider deselecting these settings menu items. Then run a Spybot scan again to see if this fixes the problems.

Spybot has a number of useful tools (see Advanced Mode, Tools menu) to identify unwanted programs and potential other problems. I find the ActiveX, BHO's, and System Startup tools particularly helpful. Consider disabling the items, on these various tool menus, that you don't think you need (such as, start menu items that "automatically check for software updates" (that run on Windows 98?)}. You can go back and re-enable these items, at any time, if these items are later found to be needed. Or better yet, consider running Spybot under Windows 98 in safe mode. If Spybot problems are fixed by running Windows in safe mode, Spybot problems may be caused by these Windows startup items, or other problems with the Windows installation itself. To start Windows 98SE in safe mode, I hold down my keyboard's "Ctrl" key during system startup, and select safe mode from the menu.

If you suspect problems with the Windows installation itself, first consider repairing and compressing the Windows Registry (Other options are potentially somewhat scary and time-intensive). Prior to repairing the Windows Registry, I first run CCleaner, Scandisk, and Defrag, to clean my hard drives and the Registry. Next, I do a full backup of my "Drive C:", which backup includes the Windows Registry. Next I restart Windows, holding down my keyboard's "Ctrl" key during system startup, and selecting control prompt from the menu. I enter "SCANREG /?" to view registry options. I enter "SCANREG /FIX" to repair and compress the Windows Registry. Do not run the other registry options (not applicable to these problems and potentially harmful).

[JorgeA]

rilef, on 16 April 2010 - 02:12 PM, said:

I checked my memory usage during another Spybot scan. Memory usage was an acceptable 45% to 48%, apx 62 Mb, of which apx 53 Mb was attributable to Spybot. (Memory was obtained by right-clicking the My Computer icon, and selecting Properties and then the Performance tab. Spybot memory usage was computed by taking memory usage at startup (apx 93% free or 7% usage), and deducting this amount from memory usage when Spybot was running). My suspicion is that, while memory usage (and number of file set items scanned) may dramatically affect the speed of the scan, memory usage is not the cause of the computer crashes and freezes being discussed.

I next visited the Spybot user forum website (A very active and informative forum, it appears). No recent memory issues were noted. But there were several posts relating to the fact that Spybot is very CPU intensive. Of particular note was criticism of two real-time Spybot processes (SDHelper and TeaTimer) as resource hogs. I have not installed either of these Spybot features on my computer, so I can't comment on the criticism. But users with Spybot-related crash and freeze problems should consider disabling or uninstalling these Spybot features, if they haven't already done so. Then run a Spybot scan again to see if this fixes the problems.

Spybot has a number of settings that may increase CPU usage, especially at the end of scans when computer crashes and freezes seem to be occurring (see Advanced Mode, Settings menu). I have deselected all items from the settings menu, except for "Save all settings" and "Display confirmation dialogs before doing critical changes". I don't have Spybot produce bug reports, log reports, or other reports; or create backups and restore points; or run at startup and other automated procedures. Instead, I find that Spybot finds at most a handful of suspected spyware items (usually none), and these few items can be best disposed of manually. Users with Spybot-related crash and freeze problems should consider deselecting these settings menu items. Then run a Spybot scan again to see if this fixes the problems.

Spybot has a number of useful tools (see Advanced Mode, Tools menu) to identify unwanted programs and potential other problems. I find the ActiveX, BHO's, and System Startup tools particularly helpful. Consider disabling the items, on these various tool menus, that you don't think you need (such as, start menu items that "automatically check for software updates" (that run on Windows 98?)}. You can go back and re-enable these items, at any time, if these items are later found to be needed. Or better yet, consider running Spybot under Windows 98 in safe mode. If Spybot problems are fixed by running Windows in safe mode, Spybot problems may be caused by these Windows startup items, or other problems with the Windows installation itself. To start Windows 98SE in safe mode, I hold down my keyboard's "Ctrl" key during system startup, and select safe mode from the menu.

If you suspect problems with the Windows installation itself, first consider repairing and compressing the Windows Registry (Other options are potentially somewhat scary and time-intensive). Prior to repairing the Windows Registry, I first run CCleaner, Scandisk, and Defrag, to clean my hard drives and the Registry. Next, I do a full backup of my "Drive C:", which backup includes the Windows Registry. Next I restart Windows, holding down my keyboard's "Ctrl" key during system startup, and selecting control prompt from the menu. I enter "SCANREG /?" to view registry options. I enter "SCANREG /FIX" to repair and compress the Windows Registry. Do not run the other registry options (not applicable to these problems and potentially harmful).

Hello rilef,

Thanks very much for the extensive roundup. I'll try each of your suggestions in turn and report back.

Right now I am running a Spybot scan with SDHelper and TeaTimer disabled, everything else left untouched. CPU usage after disabling them and closing Spybot, and before reloading it, was 44% (56% free); after reloading Spybot it was 51% (49% free). (Total RAM is 384MB.)

Hopefully it won't come to this, but I'm starting to think that ultimately I may have to do a clean install of Windows 98, just of get rid of the accumulated crud on that system. <shudder>

The Safer Networking forum for Spybot is indeed an excellent one, but after several rounds of trying to solve my issue there (some of it via e-mail) we seemed to come to a dead end. That's how I ended up here.

Thanks again!

--JorgeA

[JorgeA]

rilef,

I've tried most of the choices you suggested, doing a Spybot scan after each one: Disabled SDHelper and TeaTimer -- new scan. I deselected all the items from the Settings menu, except for the two you mentioned -- new scan. I didn't have a lot of items ticked under Tools, but I went ahead and unticked them -- new scan. I downloaded and ran CCleaner, as had been proposed earlier in this thread -- new scan.

All of these attempts have been defeated by the same blasted problem and error message.

Next I'll run a scan in Safe Mode, and if that doesn't work I may have to look into your idea to compress the registry. (I'm assuming that CCleaner repaired it adequately? It did remove a bunch of dead entries.)

Thanks very much for pitching in.

--JorgeA

[georg]

JorgeA -

You wrote: "I'm starting to think that ultimately I may have to do a clean install of Windows 98"

If you are otherwise happy with the operation of your PC, consider instead to uninstall SSD & forget it.

rilef wrote: "Spybot finds at most a handful of suspected spyware items (usually none)"

I agree. It's a longtime favorite, but it's slow now on older hardware and there are other options.

There aren't any comments so far about your screenshots. My first reaction was that you have an awful lot going on while SSD is running. I'm hoping that's not true in your recent tests. Get rid of absolutely everything but SSD and Win98 until you get a successful SSD scan. Then you can start adding things back one by one.

Applying all of rilef's suggestions to my Win98fe system, it still takes over 4 minutes to load, and even with all file sets disabled, the progress bar for 29/29 speeds to conclusion and then the system just sits there for 1 min 32 secs before the green check mark appears. Are you waiting long enough?

As for heaps, no matter how much memory you have installed, Win98 mostly uses a single 32-bit heap, capable of addressing 2GB, and one 16-bit heap for compatibility with legacy programs. My limited understanding of heaps is that they are what Windows calls "system resources" and you can monitor them with the Resource Meter icon.

Start > Programs > Accessories > System Tools > Resource Meter

On my system with 366 Celeron and 128MB RAM, the icon always stays comfortably green during loading of SSD with default settings, SD Helper and Tea Timer enabled, and all file sets checked.

Right clicking the icon will bring up a dialog box.

Right after reboot, showing only Explorer and Systray in the Close Programs dialog box, Resource Meter shows:

System resources: 95% free
User resources: 95% free
GDI resources: 98% free

Loading SSD with SD Helper and Teatimer running, default settings and all file sets enabled, at the end of load Resource Meter shows:

System resources: 58% free
User resources: 84% free
GDI resources: 58% free

I then exit Teatimer by right clicking the icon and choosing "Exit SpybotS&D Resident". During the scan, at normal priority, Resource Meter still shows 58/84/58. At "Time Critical" priority and minimized, the reading is 57/82/57.

As usual, my post is running overlong, so I'm going to stop here and give you a chance to respond.

[JorgeA]

georg,

Not to worry about the length of your posts -- I sure do appreciate your taking the time and interest to help me find out what's going on.

I ran a Spybot scan in Safe Mode as rilef suggested: no dice!! Still got the invalid page fault. This was with the SSD settings as last I described them to rilef. I'm attaching a fresh screenshot of that. (Nothing shows up after the "stack dump" line.) Hopefully this will give us some clues. You're a heck of a lot better equipped, knowledge-wise, than I am to interpret what's going on there.

The invalid page fault appears at the end of the scan and it doesn't matter how long I wait -- other than running some other program, the only thing I can do with Spybot at that point is to click on the Close button and then both the error message and the Spybot window go away.

One other interesting (maybe) data point. Before one of the test scans today, I thought to load Dr. Watson to see if it could find anything when the "illegal operation" error inevitably came up. I ran the scan, and then promptly messed up my plan by hitting the OK button before saving the Dr. Watson log. Curiously, both the Dr. Watson box and the invalid page fault box disappeared immediately, while the Spybot window stayed on instead of closing as usual -- but it wouldn't do anything, just showed a cursor arrow with an hourglass. I let it sit for about an hour, and (as nothing was happening) then clicked to close it, which did work.

You said that there are other options for anti-spyware programs. Originally I installed SSD as an anti-malware complement to Norton Internet Security. I let the Norton yearly subscription lapse in December '08 when I bought my Vista system. (Interestingly, the Norton firewall still operates, as does the virus scan but with outdated definitions of course.) I'm now using Avast! 4.8 for current AV definitions, but I'd like to keep using Spybot or some other supplementary malware killer because, as we know, no one program catches everything. And ideally it would be freeware or shareware. What would you recommend to replace Spybot and to complement Avast?

Again, thanks very much for your ongoing interest.

--JorgeA

Attached File(s)

•  SpybotScreenshot041710.pdf (12.77K)
  Number of downloads: 9

This post has been edited by JorgeA: 17 April 2010 - 09:11 PM

[JorgeA]

Prozactive, on 13 April 2010 - 10:33 AM, said:

Good advice from georg, et al. I recommend you also rule out memory and other hardware issues as a possible cause of your problems by running various diagnostic tools like Memtest86, Windows Memory Diagnostic, etc. Spybot runs fine on my Win98 systems although quite slowly as others have mentioned. On my slowest system (mobile Celeron 700mHz, 192MB RAM), it usually takes about 5-7 mins to load and around 1.5 hrs to scan my 6GB Win98 partition. I've never encountered any page fault or other errors, although after the last definitions update Spybot locked up after initial loading and eventually stopped responding in Task Manager for some reason (on all of my systems). It subsequently worked fine after reloading again.

Prozactive,

I thought I'd replied to you but it doesn't look like I did, sorry about that.

A few weeks ago I discovered the Windows Memory Diagnostic tool. I used it and the RAM passed with flying colors. (The Spybot issue has been going on for almost two years.)

My hard drive monitor reports a very healthy HDD.

Is there any other hardware I should/can test with software?

Thanks very much.

--JorgeA

[georg]

JorgeA -

While I think how to best answer your questions, let's see if we can find a difference that might explain why my system runs SSD successfully with a slower processor and only one third of your RAM.

First, go to Control Panel > Add/Remove Programs > Click the Windows Setup tab. It should load successfully and let you add or remove Windows components. If your system gets screwed up, that's one of the things that often breaks. Works OK?

Second, go to Start > Help That's another thing that breaks easily. Works OK? Then exit.

Run Sysedit
autoexec.bat should be empty
config.sys should be empty
system.ini should have no lines begining Run=
Exit

Start > Programs > Accessories > System Tools > Scheduled Tasks > Delete any that exist

Right click My Computer and choose the performance tab. In the middle of the box, it should say:

"Your system is configured for optimal performance."

Under Advanced settings (at the bottom) click the File System button, and the Hard Disk tab:

Typical role of this computer: Network server (no, mine isn't networked & it isn't a server, but if you have more than 16MB of RAM you can choose this setting to increase the size of the file and directory cache.)

Read-ahead optimization: Full

Click the Troubleshooting tab. None of the boxes should be checked.

Back to the Performance box, click the Graphics tab. Hardware acceleration: Full

Click the Virtual Memory tab. Tick "Let me specify my own virtual memory settings)" and then check the box to "Disable virtual memory (Not recommended)" OK, Close, restart. When it comes back up, go back to Virtual Memory and Tick "Let Windows manage my virtual memory settings (Recommended)". OK, Close, Restart. This will flush and defragment your swap file to make certain you are not using one that has become corrupted.

When the system comes back up, right click the desktop and choose Properties.

Background should be: (None)
Screen Saver should be: (None)
Effects: No boxes checked.
Web: No boxes checked.
Settings: 800 x 600, True Color (24 bit)

Double click My Computer and right click Drive C: 30% or more free space.
On the Tools tab: "You last checked this drive for errors 0 days ago"

Run msconfig. Nothing should be checked except System Tray.

Load Spybot Search & Destroy. Set to Advanced Mode.

Tools > Resident > Check "SDHelper" but leave "TeaTimer" unchecked.

Tools > System Startup > Nothing checked but SysTray.exe and Explorer.exe

Settings > File Sets > Uncheck all indented file sets, leaving only the topmost box checked.

Settings (at the top) click the Defaults button.

At this point you should have no running programs except SSD and no icons in the System Tray.

Click Search & Destroy and then Check for problems.

The status bar should read Running bot-check (29/29...

On this run I got a green check mark in one minute 37 seconds. You?

[JorgeA]

georg,

Well, what a frustrating day it was!!!

After following your excellent, detailed instructions, and after a number of false starts and about 15 reboots – some of them prescribed, others due to problems that cropped up as you’ll see – I finally finished my reply to you and clicked on the button to post it, when – all of a sudden – the MSFN website goes down. As of this writing (I’m preparing this in Outlook, to copy and paste when the site finally is up again), I’ve been waiting for just about three hours. I suppose it’s Sunday night site maintenance.

Anyway, I want to express my gratitude for the extensive protocol. Although I have completely lost my reply to you as I’d originally written it, I’ll try to reconstruct what I said. Basically I will be quoting your directions, and then providing my results or comments on each as we go along. For convenience, my comments are prefaced with a dash (--) and start in ALL CAPS. So here goes –

First, go to Control Panel > Add/Remove Programs > Click the Windows Setup tab. It should load successfully and let you add or remove Windows components. If your system gets screwed up, that's one of the things that often breaks. Works OK?

--YES.

Second, go to Start > Help That's another thing that breaks easily. Works OK? Then exit.

--YES.

Run Sysedit
autoexec.bat should be empty
config.sys should be empty
system.ini should have no lines begining Run=
Exit

--AUTOEXEC.BAT is not empty, but it consists entirely of REM lines.
CONFIG.SYS is not empty, but it’s mostly REM lines. However, there are three DEVICE lines, for SETVER.EXE, RTC.CLK +R, and HIMEM.SYS. However they might have gotten there (for all I know, they’ve always been there), I’m not brave enough to remove them.
SYSTEM.INI did not have any lines starting with Run=

Start > Programs > Accessories > System Tools > Scheduled Tasks > Delete any that exist

--DONE. I had scheduled periodical tasks for defragging, ScanDisk, Disk Cleanup, and Norton SystemWorks One-Button Checkup. (None of them at the same time as any of the others.)

Right click My Computer and choose the performance tab. In the middle of the box, it should say:
"Your system is configured for optimal performance."

--YES, that’s how it reads.

Under Advanced settings (at the bottom) click the File System button, and the Hard Disk tab:
Typical role of this computer: Network server (no, mine isn't networked & it isn't a server, but if you have more than 16MB of RAM you can choose this setting to increase the size of the file and directory cache.)

--DONE. I had that set to “Desktop computer,” and therefore changed it.

Read-ahead optimization: Full

--YES.

Click the Troubleshooting tab. None of the boxes should be checked.

--YES.

Back to the Performance box, click the Graphics tab. Hardware acceleration: Full

--YES, that’s right.

Click the Virtual Memory tab. Tick "Let me specify my own virtual memory settings)" and then check the box to "Disable virtual memory (Not recommended)" OK, Close, restart. When it comes back up, go back to Virtual Memory and Tick "Let Windows manage my virtual memory settings (Recommended)". OK, Close, Restart. This will flush and defragment your swap file to make certain you are not using one that has become corrupted.

--I HAD a bit of trouble here. After disabling virtual memory and restarting, instead of my usual desktop I saw a “Restore Active Desktop” screen, where moreover nothing worked except (IIRC) I could move the cursor around uselessly. I ended up having to reboot with a floppy and restoring a previous registry CAB using SCANREG.EXE in DOS. Started the protocol all over again (in case any changes were lost), getting as far as disabling virtual memory, and the same thing happened again. I think I’d better leave the virtual memory alone and let Windows manage it. Ran through the whole protocol (up to this point) once again.

When the system comes back up, right click the desktop and choose Properties.
Background should be: (None)
Screen Saver should be: (None)
Effects: No boxes checked.
Web: No boxes checked.
Settings: 800 x 600, True Color (24 bit)

--DONE. The monitor settings did include a True Color choice, but it was 32-bit and not 24. There was, among others, also a 16-bit High Color option. I selected the 32-bit True Color.

Double click My Computer and right click Drive C: 30% or more free space.
On the Tools tab: "You last checked this drive for errors 0 days ago"

--HDD space is ~6GB out of 12. It claims that I last checked the drive 135 days ago, but that must be because I had to resort to the backup registry with previous information. I last did a whole ScanDisk run just last week. ADDITION: Did a new ScanDisk and Defrag overnight while waiting for the site to come back up.

Run msconfig. Nothing should be checked except System Tray.

--DONE.

Load Spybot Search & Destroy. Set to Advanced Mode.
Tools > Resident > Check "SDHelper" but leave "TeaTimer" unchecked.
Tools > System Startup > Nothing checked but SysTray.exe and Explorer.exe
Settings > File Sets > Uncheck all indented file sets, leaving only the topmost box checked.
Settings (at the top) click the Defaults button.

--ALL DONE.

At this point you should have no running programs except SSD and no icons in the System Tray.

--YES. It does still show the Volume icon for the speakers.

Click Search & Destroy and then Check for problems.

--DONE.

The status bar should read Running bot-check (29/29...
On this run I got a green check mark in one minute 37 seconds. You?

--UH-OH: Spybot ran through the entire progress bar in a fraction of a second and then the whole screen froze, even the cursor. So bad that I had to turn off the power. Tried it again, first going through the entire protocol again to make sure that no settings had gotten messed up or reverted to the previous value: same thing happened. SSD never did get as far as showing “XX/XX,” or even an error message of any kind when it crashed.

It was at this point that I finished composing my reply to you (I’d been adding items as I went along), then hit the button to post it – and the MSFN page became unavailable. “Internet Explorer cannot display the webpage” is the exact phrase I’m getting. (Other websites are working just fine, except for – strangely enough – the Win98banter.com forum.)

Subsequently, as a test, I rebooted the PC, reloaded Spybot, and added some of the file sets back in, just to see what happened in this reduced memory load environment. It ran through the scan as before… and as before, it gave me the blasted illegal operation/invalid page fault message at the very end. AAARRRGGGGHHHHH!!!

End of reply. A long and frustrating day. Now I’m just waiting for MSFN to come back up so I can post the reply. And running ScanDisk again, in case that’s needed in order to proceed properly from here on out.

So Doc, what do you think?

--JorgeA

This post has been edited by JorgeA: 19 April 2010 - 09:26 AM

[georg]

JorgeA -

Well, my "excellent, detailed instructions" were just a little out of sequence. Apparently you have to disable Active Desktop before you can disable virtual memory. That was the point of "Web: No boxes checked."

http://en.wikipedia..../Active_Desktop
"Active Desktop was largely considered to be a failure, with one of the main problems being its high use of system resources and reduction in system stability."

To disable the Active Desktop:

Start > Settings > Control Panel. > Open the Display icon > Click the Web tab in the Display Properties window.

disable Active Desktop = make sure that "View my Active Desktop as a web page" is unchecked.

Start > Settings > Folder Options > Be sure "Classic Style" is ticked.

Reboot, then try again to flush and recreate your swap file.

Try the short Spybot scan again and tell me what happens.

Try not to get discouraged. I'm blindfolded and operating by remote control. I can't see your computer and only know what you tell me. As a problem solving tool, reciprocating posts is incredibly slow and inefficient.

Note: If you later wish to enable Active Desktop, check the box for "View my Active Desktop as a web page" and select the home page you wish to use as the active desktop. Retick the folder option for "Web style".

[JorgeA]

georg, on 19 April 2010 - 11:21 AM, said:

JorgeA -

Well, my "excellent, detailed instructions" were just a little out of sequence. Apparently you have to disable Active Desktop before you can disable virtual memory. That was the point of "Web: No boxes checked."

http://en.wikipedia..../Active_Desktop
"Active Desktop was largely considered to be a failure, with one of the main problems being its high use of system resources and reduction in system stability."

To disable the Active Desktop:

Start > Settings > Control Panel. > Open the Display icon > Click the Web tab in the Display Properties window.

disable Active Desktop = make sure that "View my Active Desktop as a web page" is unchecked.

Start > Settings > Folder Options > Be sure "Classic Style" is ticked.

Reboot, then try again to flush and recreate your swap file.

Try the short Spybot scan again and tell me what happens.

Try not to get discouraged. I'm blindfolded and operating by remote control. I can't see your computer and only know what you tell me. As a problem solving tool, reciprocating posts is incredibly slow and inefficient.

Note: If you later wish to enable Active Desktop, check the box for "View my Active Desktop as a web page" and select the home page you wish to use as the active desktop. Retick the folder option for "Web style".

georg,

Not to worry -- I'm not discouraged. I was actually fine with the whole process, steadily inching my way forward (and learning a ton, thank you), till at the very end of it I lost the reply to you that I'd been working on all afternoon because the forum website went down. That's what really tipped me over the edge. In the future, if I know that I'll be composing a reply that'll take a long while to prepare, I'll make sure to save it before hitting that "Add Reply" button!

Anyway, I have now flushed the swap file and recreated it. I loaded Spybot, verified the settings you indicated, and made sure they are all as per the directions. Only the "Integrated search for spybots" is checked, even the Usage Tracking is unchecked.

O.K., I did this twice. Both times the progress bar ran all the way to the end before SSD even had the chance to say how many (XX/XX) items it had gone through. (It read only, "Running bot-check".) And each time, within about 3 seconds (I was using a stopwatch), the whole screen froze, such that I had to switch off the power.

Not a happy sight, but hopefully this will provide clues to help us move forward.

BTW, I do have to say that with these settings the machine is booting a heck of a lot faster!

Thanks again.

--JorgeA

[georg]

JorgeA -

Let's take a break.

You wrote: "What would you recommend to replace Spybot and to complement Avast?"

Here are seven choices, all but one free, useful in combating malware and solving computer problems in general. Current working links are given for each recommendation. Small, efficient, they don't hog system resources, and current versions support Win 98. Google the names if you want more details and reviews.

1. Spywareblaster 4.3

http://www.filehippo...spywareblaster/

A relatively small program (the installer download is about 3MB) with a free edition for home use that works to keep malware from getting on your computer, as opposed to scanning for malware that is already there. Once installed, it uses no system resources. Supports 98/Me/NT/2000/XP/Vista/7

The website is www.javacoolsoftware.com and the forum is at http://www.wilderssecurity.com/ Runs fine on Win98, although "enabling protection" is a little slow. Updates are very small, very fast, come out every couple of weeks.

2. WinPatrol 17.0.2010.0.0 by Bill Pytlovany (BillP Studios)

http://www.filehippo...load_winpatrol/

WinPatrol alerts you to hijackings, malware attacks and critical changes, using a heuristic behavioral approach. "You'll be removing dangerous new programs while others prepare to update their definition/signature data files." The installer is 971KB (Freeware) smaller than it was years ago. Small Memory Footprint. The monitor component is only 313 KB. See also website www.winpatrol.com Supports 98/2000/XP/Vista

3. Microsoft ERU (Emergency Recovery Utility) originally supplied on the W95 CD-ROM (but not the floppy version.)

http://download.micr...n-us/eruzip.exe

Very small (670 bytes), freeware, very simple W95/W98 registry backup to a floppy or directory. Backup before you add any hardware or software, or make any significant system changes. Backup every day before you shut down.
Use rotating sets of bootable system disks, or put each day in a folder on a USB key or removable hard drive.

See for instructions: http://css.its.psu.e...echmatters.html

4. StartupCPL by Mike Lin, who writes great small programs

http://www.mlin.net/StartupCPL.shtml

A 72K program that adds a .cpl applet to Control Panel. Much easier to use than msconfig for turning startup programs on or off. Look at www.mlin.net/index.shtml for information about Mike and his other projects.

5. Dependency Walker 2.2.6, (depends.exe), another Microsoft project, a useful tool for trouble-shooting application errors, file registration errors, memory access violations, and invalid page faults. Runs standalone from a directory and does not install system files or make changes to the registry. 95/98/Me/NT/2000/XP/2003/Vista

http://www.dependenc...pends22_x86.zip

See also http://support.microsoft.com/kb/256872 and the home page www.dependencywalker.com

6. Vantec Model CB-ISATAU2 IDE/SATA to USB Adapter, $19.99 at newegg.com

http://www.vantecusa...view_detail/266

A connector with its own power supply and firmware, and long cables, that makes any hard drive work as conveniently as a USB key, in or out of a computer. At the Vantec website, there is a manual you can download and a driver for Win 98. Supports USB 1.1 and 2.0. Use it to slave your Win 98 drive to a more modern system so you can scan it with software that doesn't run on W98. Nothing is installed on anything you plug it into. This device will allow you to run SpybotS&D on your Vista box and scan your Win 98 drive using the right click menu.

7. The software recommended by the malware and virus removal forum at windowsbbs.com

http://www.windowsbb...-virus-removal/

Read especially http://www.windowsbb...ouncements.html

Follow some of the threads by Broni to get a good understanding of what it takes to remove malware these days. The Vantec adapter will help you use more aggressive removal tools like Malwarebytes to scan your Win 98 drive, and will make backups and file transfers painless. Cheaper and easier than setting up a wired network.

Your safest strategy is to isolate Win 98 from the internet, and make periodic full disk backups, along with regular backups of the registry and files you care about. Armor up your Vista box, download files there and scan them before transferring them to Win98.

Let me know if you have questions, also when and if you want to start again om Spybot.

[JorgeA]

georg,

Once again, I greatly appreciate the detailed information you have provided. I have some homework to do, many thanks to you.

I will definitely be back with follow-up questions. But for now, let me say that everyone who has pitched in to this thread, but you especially, have been a true model of what a person with a knotty problem to solve is hoping for when joining a help forum. You have asked good questions, given detailed instructions, and -- best of all -- stayed right in it throughout. What else could one ask for?

We are going away for a few days this week, so I probably won't be able to post again right away, but that's all right because I need first to explore the several options you kindly suggested. I'll make sure to put Spybot in the title so that you know.

Definitely do want to see if we can get to the bottom of the Spybot issue.

--JorgeA

[rilef]

JorgeA -

Just a few items to add to Georg's list:

Have all the updates been installed for your Windows 98 FE system? Missing updates should still be available from Microsoft or from http://www.mdgx.com/upd98me.php .

Avast has indicated it will be ending Windows 98 support in a few months (see the Avast thread). To my knowledge, this will make "Clamwin", and related "Clam Sentinel", the only installed free antivirus software available for Windows 98. Also, to my knowledge, Spybot is the only installed free antispyware software available for Windows 98.

I don't recommend either SpywareBlaster, or Spybot's similar "Immunize" process. Both SpywareBlaster, and SpyBot's "Immunize", essentially work by adding thousands of entries to Internet Explorer's "Restricted Sites" and/or Internet Explorer's cookie "Privacy" lists, and/or the Window's hosts file. I considered these lists as ineffective and unwanted overhead, further slowing down an already slow computer- especially, since I seldom used Internet Explorer. (For Firefox, SpywareBlaster and Spybot did not add any significant security functions not already built in to Firefox or available from Firefox addons). So, I completely removed all these lists. and replaced them with other security. And, as slow as both of these programs are to load and run, it took me an inordinate amount of hours to remove these lists from Internet Explorer. (Note, if you uninstall Spybot, be sure to remove all prior immunization first. This task cannot be practicably done manually).

Instead of SpywareBlaster or Spybot's Immunize process, I use the latest version of Opera (10.51) as my primary browser for both Windows XP and Windows 98SE computers. Opera has built-in siteblocker, which I use to block unwanted content and stat/tracking sites using the fanboy site filter list )downloaded from http://www.fanboy.co.nz/adblock/opera/ }. Opera also permits content blocking, cookie policy, and other security to be set both universally and on a site-by-site basis. And, I receive warnings from the search engine, or Opera itself, of blocked or dangerous sites. I also have installed Firefox 3.5, running under Kernelex, to replace the less secure Firefox 2.0.

Internet Explorer security was updated by downloading and installing the "Unofficial Internet Explorer 6.0 SP1 Component Update (MDIE6CU) 3.2" from http://www.mdgx.com/upd98me.php . I use SlimBrowser, which uses the Internet Explorer engine and security settings, rather than using the Internet Explorer browser directly (for both Windows XP and Windows 98SE computers). SlimBrowser has
four built-in sitefilter lists, similar to Opera's, as well as tabbed browsing and other features not available in Internet Explorer 6. I've set Internet Explorer's Privacy settings to custom, to block all cookies generally, then adding cookies-allowed exceptions manually.

Cookie managers for Internet Explorer(IECookiesView) and Firefox (MozillaCookiesView) were downloaded from http://www.nirsoft.net Flash cookies and other Flash settings are accessed at http://www.macromedi..._manager07.html .

And of course, I use effective hardware (router) and software (Sybase) firewalls to further reduce malware threats.

[JorgeA]

georg, on 19 April 2010 - 04:49 PM, said:

Here are seven choices, all but one free, useful in combating malware and solving computer problems in general. Current working links are given for each recommendation. Small, efficient, they don't hog system resources, and current versions support Win 98. Google the names if you want more details and reviews.

[...]

6. Vantec Model CB-ISATAU2 IDE/SATA to USB Adapter, $19.99 at newegg.com

http://www.vantecusa...view_detail/266

A connector with its own power supply and firmware, and long cables, that makes any hard drive work as conveniently as a USB key, in or out of a computer. At the Vantec website, there is a manual you can download and a driver for Win 98. Supports USB 1.1 and 2.0. Use it to slave your Win 98 drive to a more modern system so you can scan it with software that doesn't run on W98. Nothing is installed on anything you plug it into. This device will allow you to run SpybotS&D on your Vista box and scan your Win 98 drive using the right click menu.

7. The software recommended by the malware and virus removal forum at windowsbbs.com

http://www.windowsbb...-virus-removal/

Read especially http://www.windowsbb...ouncements.html

Follow some of the threads by Broni to get a good understanding of what it takes to remove malware these days. The Vantec adapter will help you use more aggressive removal tools like Malwarebytes to scan your Win 98 drive, and will make backups and file transfers painless. Cheaper and easier than setting up a wired network.

Your safest strategy is to isolate Win 98 from the internet, and make periodic full disk backups, along with regular backups of the registry and files you care about. Armor up your Vista box, download files there and scan them before transferring them to Win98.

Let me know if you have questions, also when and if you want to start again om Spybot.

georg,

We’re back and I’m itching to keep working on this knotty Spybot issue.

While we gear back up for that, in the meantime I want to address a couple of your kind suggestions. (Everything I don’t mention here, you can be sure that I will be looking into after we either solve or give up on the Spybot issue.)

Numbers 6 and 7: I bought my Vista machine after my Win98 PC got sick in December ’08. Once I got the new system up and running, and things settled down, I started investigating what I could do about the Win98 computer. That’s when I started to really learn about modern computers (or semi-modern ones, anyway), as ever since Windows 3.1 came out and DOS receded into the background I had approached computers basically as black boxes that performed magic for me. When I discovered that it was possible to download USB drivers that would allow my Windows 98 PC to recognize today’s flash drives, I did a complete backup (including hidden files) to a 16GB USB thumb drive in case the system died completely. (I presently have two kinds of backup: an MSBACKUP – yup, I learned about the 4 GB file size limit – and two manual, right-drag backups, all to different flash drives.)

(As an aside, the Spybot crash issue had started some 8-10 months before, so I doubt that it had anything to do with the computer’s problems at the end of 2008. After the computer sat completely unused for a couple months, it started booting normally again the next time I tried it. It worked even better after I blew out all the dust bunnies that had built up inside over the years….)

Out of curiosity (and this is where it ties in to your suggestions), I plugged the thumb drive into my Vista machine and scanned it using Norton 360, Windows Defender, and (of course) Spybot: they didn’t find anything wrong.

N360’s Site Safety feature where it rates Web pages with a green check mark or a red X is so cool that now, anytime I need to download anything to the Windows 98 PC, first I go to the site on my Vista machine to see what Norton has to say. Sometimes I download first to the Vista and then transfer via thumb drive, but lately I’ve been mostly doing this “dual visit” procedure and downloading directly to the old computer.

As I said, I do intend to explore the other options you provided, but the Spybot issue has become a challenge and I’m eager to see if we can figure out what the heck is going on.

Looking forward to working again with you and the other good folks on the MSFN forum!

--JorgeA

[JorgeA]

rilef,

Thanks very much for the supplemental information.

Yes, my Win98 FE has all the security updates Microsoft ever made available for that system. When I go on the Windows Update page now, instead of getting a list of available updates I get redirected to a new page suggesting that I upgrade to Windows 7.

If I read your post correctly, you’re using three different browsers (Opera 10.51, Firefox 3.5, and IE6, or maybe SlimBrowser). Do you use each one for a different purpose?

I checked out the Sybase website for a firewall (I’m still using NIS for that function), but didn’t find anything there with a likely-sounding name. Which Sybase product are you using? Also, what’s your view of ZoneAlarm? I found that it’s possible to download an older, basic version that works on Windows 98.

Much appreciated!

--JorgeA

[georg]

JorgeA -

According to Dependency Walker, SpybotSD.exe loads the following Dynamic Link Libraries, Device Driver and Object Linking and Embedding Control Extension (Active-X control).

Compare your files and file dates with the ones which are on my system

(listed in the order they are loaded by SpybotSD.exe)

MSOSS.DLL (5/11/98)
CRYPT32.DLL (5/11/98)
SQLITE3.DLL (6/19/08)
NETBIOS.DLL (5/11/98)
NETAPI.DLL (5/18/99)
WSOCK32.DLL (5/18/99)
WINMM.DLL (5/11/98)
COMDLG32.DLL (5/11/98)
WININET.DLL (5/11/98)
SHLWAPI.DLL (5/11/98)
SHELL32.DLL (5/11/98)
WINSPOOL.DRV (5/11/98)
COMCTL32.DLL (4/30/99)
MPR.DLL (5/11/98)
VERSION.DLL (5/11/98)
USER32.DLL (5/11/98)
ADVAPI32.DLL (5/11/98)
KERNEL32.DLL (5/11/98)
GDI32.DLL (5/11/98)
OLE32.DLL (5/11/98)
OLEAUT32.DLL (5/4/01)
WS2HELP.DLL (5/11/98)
MSVCRT.DLL (11/14/03)
WS2_32.DLL (5/11/98)
MSWSOCK.DLL (5/11/98)
MSIMG32.DLL (5/11/98)
OLEPRO32.DLL (3/8/99)
OLEACC.DLL (5/11/98)
RPCRT4.DLL (5/11/98)
MAPI32.DLL (5/11/98)
TOOLS.DLL (7/7/08)
URLMON.DLL (5/11/98)
HHCTRL.OCX (4/24/00)
RICHED32.DLL (5/11/98)
TCIPADDRESS.DLL (12/24/07)
CHAI.DLL (3/4/08)
FENNEL.DLL (3/5/08)
MATE.DLL (2/26/08)
SHDOCVW.DLL (5/11/98)

All will be found in C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM except
SQLITE3.DLL is in C:\Program Files\Spybot - Search & Destroy
TOOLS.DLL is in C:\Program Files\Spybot - Search & Destroy
TCIPADDRESS.DLL is in is in C:\Program Files\Spybot - Search & Destroy\Plugins
CHAI.DLL is in C:\Program Files\Spybot - Search & Destroy\Plugins
FENNEL.DLL is in C:\Program Files\Spybot - Search & Destroy\Plugins
MATE.DLL is in C:\Program Files\Spybot - Search & Destroy\Plugins

So. Check your files. What's different?

[JorgeA]

Hi georg,

Thanks for resuming the investigation!

The results are very interesting, although I'm not totally sure what I'm doing here.

For convenience, I'm reproducing your list below, with the "File Time Stamp" dates for my corresponding files off to the right.

FWIW, the files were listed by Dependency Walker in (mostly) alphabetical order, differently from yours.

MSOSS.DLL (5/11/98) (3/18/99)
CRYPT32.DLL (5/11/98) (9/12/02)
SQLITE3.DLL (6/19/08) (6/19/98)
NETBIOS.DLL (5/11/98) (5/11/98)
NETAPI.DLL (5/18/99) not listed
WSOCK32.DLL (5/18/99) (12/14/98)
WINMM.DLL (5/11/98) (5/11/98)
COMDLG32.DLL (5/11/98) (5/11/98)
WININET.DLL (5/11/98) (4/28/06)
SHLWAPI.DLL (5/11/98) (8/31/05)
SHELL32.DLL (5/11/98) (12/06/01)
WINSPOOL.DRV (5/11/98) (05/1198)
COMCTL32.DLL (4/30/99) (8/29/02)
MPR.DLL (5/11/98) (5/11/98)
VERSION.DLL (5/11/98) (5/11/98)
USER32.DLL (5/11/98) (12/04/09)
ADVAPI32.DLL (5/11/98) (5/11/98)
KERNEL32.DLL (5/11/98) (5/11/98)
GDI32.DLL (5/11/98) (5/11/98)
OLE32.DLL (5/11/98) (3/29/99)
OLEAUT32.DLL (5/4/01) (3/16/01)
WS2HELP.DLL (5/11/98) not listed
MSVCRT.DLL (11/14/03) (4/06/200)
WS2_32.DLL (5/11/98) not listed
MSWSOCK.DLL (5/11/98) not listed
MSIMG32.DLL (5/11/98) not listed
OLEPRO32.DLL (3/8/99) not listed
OLEACC.DLL (5/11/98) not listed
RPCRT4.DLL (5/11/98) (3/29/99)
MAPI32.DLL (5/11/98) not listed
TOOLS.DLL (7/7/08) not listed
URLMON.DLL (5/11/98) urlmon.dll
HHCTRL.OCX (4/24/00) not listed
RICHED32.DLL (5/11/98) not listed
TCIPADDRESS.DLL (12/24/07) not listed
CHAI.DLL (3/4/08) not listed
FENNEL.DLL (3/5/08) not listed
MATE.DLL (2/26/08) not listed
SHDOCVW.DLL (5/11/98) not listed

In addition, a bunch of files were listed that are not on your list:
IMAGEHLP.DLL (9/14/02)
NETAPI32.DLL (5/11/98)
SPYBOTSD.EXE (1/26/09)
CFGMGR32.DLL (5/11/98)
LZ32.DLL (5/11/98)
MLANG.DLL (8/29/02)
MSI.DLL (1/26/02)
NTDLL.DLL (5/11/98)
SETUPAPI.DLL (5/11/98)
TAPI32.DLL (5/11/98)

Of ALL the modules given, only SPYBOTSD.EXE and SQLITE3.DLL are in the C:\PROGRAM FILES\SPYBOT - SEARCH & DESTROY162 directory; the rest are all in C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM.

In addition, DW gave a rsult of, "Error opening file. The system cannot find the file specified (2)." for the following files. Find Files didn't find them, either:
APPHELP.DLL
USERENV.DLL

Finally (and possibly related to the above), the bottom panel had two Warnings:
"At least one delay-load dependency module was not found.
"At least one module has an unresolved import due to a missing export function in a delay-load dependent module."

I imagine that at least some of the differences in files and file dates can be accounted for by the different software that we have respectively installed over the years.

In case it makes a difference, we should also note that I have left both Spybot and the PC in the limited functionality settings that you had me do last week. (Except that I did bring back some of the startup programs, as not even the CD drive was operating.)

O.K., next step! What do you think?

Gratefully,

--JorgeA

[georg]

JorgeA -

Don't use file names and dates from DW. Just show the files and file dates which you have in C:\Windows\System for each of the files which I listed.

Trying to find what is different between the system on which Spybot completes and the one on which it does not.

The format which you chose is fine.