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(SOLVED) What Gives after 4 Primary Drives


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38 replies to this topic

#1
bookie32

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Hi folks :hello:

Bit of a general question concerning partitioning a drive.

I usually buy to order new laptops for my customers and then if they have just the C: drive and now backup drive I add another partition.

This hasn't been a problem, but now in their wisdom HP have decided that a recovery drive isn't enough and that they have used up all primary options for partitioning.

Example:
On this latest G62 there is the "System" drive "C" "Recovery" and "HP_Tools".......all are Primary

There is no extra partition for people to back up their files on?! We all know that you should do backups on backups, but as long asa drive is healthy I like to shrink them to give them some space to back up files in case/when windows crashes...


Is there a solution to this? Bit stupid having one drive partition C: that is 500GBS...

Can anyone help me out here?

bookie32

Edited by bookie32, 21 March 2011 - 01:50 AM.



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#2
CoffeeFiend

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Bit stupid having one drive partition C: that is 500GBS...

That's how I like it personally. In fact, the very first thing I do to machines with a bunch of crappy small partitions is blow them all away (including recovery partitions) and recreate one nice big partition. No matter how big they make the C: partition I'll run out of space. OS + number of large apps + pagefile + temp files + large user profiles + current downloads and working files just takes a LOT of space (nevermind if you want to have some games on there too). And those other small partitions usually end up being mostly unused/wasted (while struggling to make space on C:). Of course, videos, music, vmware images, disc mages, installers and what not end up on other drives.

Most decent backup solutions will let you save the backup directly on the drive you're backuping, on an external hard drive, on a network share or FTP server (and other network-related means), on USB devices, on DVDs, etc so it hasn't been a problem for me.
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#3
bookie32

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Hi CoffeFiend :hello:

I appreciate your input....but....LOL you are not dealing with customers that have a hard time knowing how to start the computer...this was just a way for me to make it easier for them...

The other thing is I can't go removing recovery partitions etc......And most of them wouldn't know how...LOL

Thanks anyway

bookie32

#4
myselfidem

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You can find help here, example for HP Computers:

http://www.mydigital...in-hp-computer/

http://h30434.www3.h...ter/td-p/342540

Edited by myselfidem, 15 March 2011 - 03:14 AM.

For Windows 7 OS: SetProductKey.rar (fr-FR/en-US. Integrate keys).

#5
bookie32

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Hi myselfidem :hello:
I am grateful for the info...but can't in all honesty recommend to a customer to remove the recovery partition from a new computer....and a little knowledge is dangerous for those who don't know :whistle:

Thanks anyway

booke32

#6
allen2

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Why don't you just resize the partitions (using something free like systemrescueCD ) and then backup one of the not bootable one and create an extended partition with the free space then restore the backed up on to a logical and then create another one ?
What does each partition contains ?
Another thing, after doing this, you'll have to modify the HP recovery process as it could not work anymore or might delete the extended partition.

#7
bookie32

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Hi allen2

"System" drive "C" "Recovery" and "HP_Tools".......all primary
I like your idea and will have a look at that...

Thanks

bookie32

#8
cannie

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I am grateful for the info...but can't in all honesty recommend to a customer to remove the recovery partition from a new computer


Hi bookie32:

No solution at all without loosing one of the primary partitions. Taking into account the contents of all four (bootmanager, OS, recovery and manufacturer device drivers) you can't offer this to your customers.

Mind that having everything into C drive means an obvious danger for users' files and folders, forcing them to buy external backup devices....

User needs and manufacturer's interests are very different things, and as said "Good for the hound, bad for the hare".

Greetings.

Edited by cannie, 17 March 2011 - 04:49 PM.


#9
jaclaz

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No solution at all without loosing one of the primary partitions. Taking into account the contents of all four (bootmanager, OS, recovery and manufacturer device drivers) you can't offer this to your customers.

Not really, actually a couple solutions are still possible, though obviously workarounds, and NOT "additional primaries".
  • A partition can be made "logical volume inside extended" and keep bootability (if needed).
  • If using grub4dos is allowed, a "rotating set" of primary partitions is possible.

@bookie32
Let me know if any of the above just hinted thingies may suite you and I'll post more info.

jaclaz

Edited by jaclaz, 17 March 2011 - 08:16 PM.


#10
bookie32

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Hi jaclaz :hello:

Hope you are well mate!! I was thinking of the extended and logical..... Was you thinking of booting from a Linux cd and using gparted or something similar?

Thanks for coming by!

bookie32

#11
jaclaz

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I was thinking of the extended and logical..... Was you thinking of booting from a Linux cd and using gparted or something similar?

Or maybe just using Windows 7 built-in tools. :unsure:
The more likely to be a good candidate for the "move" are IMHO (strangely enough ;)):
  • the actual C: partition :w00t: (remember this is the one you have to modify anyway to make space for the "backup partition" :angel )
  • the "HP-tools" one :sneaky:

Can you post some details or - ideally - a copy of the actual MBR as attachment inside a .zip or .7z?

And please also:
  • a screenshot in disk management
  • a report about free space available in each partition

I would like to check a couple of things, and think a bit about possible "alignment" problems before attempting to suggest you which one is better suited and a possible procedure.

jaclaz

#12
myselfidem

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Anyway, I think, it is advisable to create the recovery CD first, before to create an new partition!
Maybe the recovery partition (D:\) can't working fine if the size of the partition C:\ is amended!

And if there is some trouble , you can reinstall properly your OS like the first time!

Edited by myselfidem, 18 March 2011 - 06:10 AM.

For Windows 7 OS: SetProductKey.rar (fr-FR/en-US. Integrate keys).

#13
bookie32

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Hi guys!

Have been trying for an hour to upload info and can't get any where?!!

I have removed all files and retested ...nada?

bookie32

#14
myselfidem

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I think, it's better to leave the choice to the customer to decide if he wants create an new partition or make others changes on a computer,
because if you do some changes on a computer and you delivery this one, there is no more manufacturer warranty!

Create a new partition (HP Forum)!

Example: same link given above:

http://www.mydigital...in-hp-computer/

It's just my advice!

Edited by myselfidem, 18 March 2011 - 09:33 AM.

For Windows 7 OS: SetProductKey.rar (fr-FR/en-US. Integrate keys).

#15
bookie32

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Hi

Thanks for the info....I wouldn't change anything without asking the customer first....but thanks for the warning....

bookie32

#16
bookie32

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Hi again!
Using windows software to shrink a partition will not upset your warranty...I have asked HP about this before and it doesn't change anything..

bookie32

#17
jaclaz

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Have been trying for an hour to upload info and can't get any where?!!

Are you by any chance attempting to attach "binary" files, or however anything that is not any of:
  • a .jpg or .gif or .png picture
  • a plain text file (or similar, like .htm, xml, etc.)
  • a compressed archive .zip or .7z
? :unsure:

Try compressing files into a .zip archive, and attach the actual .zip.
Check that the .zip is within the size of your allowed upload.
If not, post it on any free file hosting site and post a link to the uploaded .zip.

@myselfidem
Very good suggestions :thumbup , though personally (better be safe than sorry :ph34r: ) I would make a dd-like (forensic sound) image of the WHOLE internal disk "as is", EXPECIALLY for the first experiment, and in case of any trouble simply restore the image.

jaclaz

#18
myselfidem

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@myselfidem
Very good suggestions :thumbup , though personally (better be safe than sorry :ph34r: ) I would make a dd-like (forensic sound) image of the WHOLE internal disk "as is", EXPECIALLY for the first experiment, and in case of any trouble simply restore the image.

jaclaz


Oh yes jaclaz, it's far better to test before and save first the system! ;)

I have experienced with my computer HP and Windows XP, before!

Edited by myselfidem, 18 March 2011 - 01:49 PM.

For Windows 7 OS: SetProductKey.rar (fr-FR/en-US. Integrate keys).

#19
cannie

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Using windows software to shrink a partition will not upset your warranty.


I wonder what would you do after shrinking drive C without also changing it from primary partition into logical unit, and AFAIK warranty would be lost.
If you instead try to create any new unit into the free space all existing units would be transformed into dynamic, and this is no good at all.
Manufacturers don't leave you any way to optimize your HDD without losing your warranty, I'm afraid.

No other solution left but building an image into an external drive and a repair disk to restore everything to its first state whenever needed, then optimize freely the whole HDD and reinstall using an install DVD or pendrive.

Edited by cannie, 18 March 2011 - 02:26 PM.


#20
myselfidem

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Yes cannie, I think so.

And inside the new partition created, it's needed to use a program, like Acronis True Image or others or Windows 7 feature, to create an image backup of the system!!

However, if HP said that the warranty is safe with creating a new partition....It's interesting to test!!

In the worst case it is possible to use the recovery DVD's (I think about 3 DVD's) burned at FIRST!

Edited by myselfidem, 18 March 2011 - 02:54 PM.

For Windows 7 OS: SetProductKey.rar (fr-FR/en-US. Integrate keys).

#21
cannie

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But if HP said that the warranty is safe with creating a new partition....It's interesting to test!!


I already tested it after obtaining a HDD image, a repair disk and also a repair pendrive (to be used if the DVD drive becomes damaged). The results after reducing the C drive size and creating a new drive into the left space: all units were transformed into dynamic ones! . No more primary partitions or logical units at all.

Then I deleted everything and rebuilt the whole HDD freely using the 32 bits mode of the same 64 bits preinstalled Windows version for compatibility reasons. No problems with Microsoft at all when I activated it using the same activation key.

Until warranty expires no better solution as having the possibility of rebuilding everything, leaving the computer as it was when it was delivered to you.

Edited by cannie, 18 March 2011 - 03:43 PM.


#22
myselfidem

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Many thanks cannie for your sharing!

I think the trouble is to keep the recovery partition D:\ and create a new one reducing the partition C:\

First it's better to delete this partition (D:\) with the method discribed here - AND NOT DIRECTLY- , to MERGE C:\ and D:\; because some files are shared between those two partitions:

http://www.mydigital...in-hp-computer/

And after create a new partition!

*Edit:
@brokie32
It would be interesting to know which tools are inside the "HP Tools". Maybe some tools can delete the partition merging C:\ and D:\??

With HP and Windows XP, the only method was to create an CD Tools to do delete the recovery parttion D:\ and create a new parttion with the same CD Tools.

Edited by myselfidem, 19 March 2011 - 01:13 AM.

For Windows 7 OS: SetProductKey.rar (fr-FR/en-US. Integrate keys).

#23
cannie

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It would be interesting to know which tools are inside the "HP Tools".


You can't see it directly but all needed tools and drivers from both drives D and E are included into a folder ("swsetup", "cabs" or other name) created during the manufacturer's preinstall process into drive C. But you need both primary partitions in order to use the original function key to rebuild C drive.

The only real problem is loosing warranty.

BTW the whole process I followed to rebuild everything from scratch trying to find the best solution for everything is described here:

"How to optimize your HDD for Windows 7"

#24
jaclaz

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The only real problem is loosing warranty.

cannie :), don't take this question as an aggressive one, but can you please explain HOW the warranty is supposed to be lost by re-partitioning a hard disk?
Or if you prefer, WHERE you learned this bit of info that is completely new to me and actually the exact contrary of what bookie32 assertedly had from HP?

Rest assured that it is perfectly possible to avoid Dynamic disks using an extended partition (though there is not really any particular problem that I know of with Dynamic disks, as long as they are not mirrored and striped, and they remain "simple volumes", at least :unsure:)

jaclaz

#25
cannie

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The only real problem is loosing warranty.

cannie :), don't take this question as an aggressive one, but can you please explain HOW the warranty is supposed to be lost by re-partitioning a hard disk?


Hi jaclaz!

Maybe I'm wrong, I've never had to use warranty until now.

If warranty is not in danger leaving free a primary partition to allow an extended partition is of course the best solution.

Greetings.

cannie

Edited by cannie, 19 March 2011 - 07:08 AM.





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