[Mr Snrub]

http://dev.windows.com/
ISO downloads available - also more for MSDN subscribers.
This is the stage BEFORE beta, so don't expect to be able to use this as a production OS just yet

[Felipe]

Thanks, I'm having a look.

[Tripredacus]

Things I've figured out so far:
1. You can't install it from within Server 2008 R2 SP1. It basically says that OS is un upgradable!
2. If you boot the DVD, the "advanced" drive options doesn't give the ability to delete partitions... but you can Format them... hope this works.

[MagicAndre1981]

the ISO with the dev tools is locked and can't be used to upgrade. Use the 64Bit version without the tools.

[cluberti]

Also note that outside of Hyper-V, it really only runs on VirtualBox and physical hardware. And, I have to say, running it on VirtualBox is an exercise in bugcheck codes.

[Tripredacus]

The Task Manager is something dreamy! One tab even shows dependent processes!

The non-tools version doesn't seem to have a command prompt?

Its interesting, but It would be nicer with a touch-screen for sure.

Tomorrow I'll check out the games and try to tweet with it. Then I'll try to get it to do a BSOD, that would be great!

[cluberti]

You mean this thing?

Win+F, select apps, type cmd (or just start typing cmd at the start screen).
Also, BSODs are easy - just run it in VPC or VirtualBox, and it'll do it for you pretty quickly . And yes, touch screens make a world of difference, but using it with a tablet and a keyboard/mouse attached is frankly VERY useful. I'm thinking this Samsung is going to be my new "laptop" very soon.

[MagicAndre1981]

the new startscreen is a disaster I never had such an bad UX I have to search several minutes to do the simplest basics. Hopefully we can select which startmenu we want to use on desktop systems. On touch based tablets it may be really cool but it sucks completely with Mouse and keyboard.

It also runs with VMWare Workstation 8. I have no issues with VirtualBox.

[cluberti]

And I have the exact opposite experience - the start pane just "makes sense" to me, and everything is exactly where I'd expect them to be. It works for me either on keyboard/mouse or touch, although I would like to see the ability to disable it simply to sell copies of Windows 8 to folks who are stuck in 1995 .

[MagicAndre1981]

This teletubby style is nothing for me. For a touch monitor it is nice, but not for a Desktop PC with mouse/keyboard. MSFT made the mistake several years to force tablet users to run a non touch UI, now they force the PCs users to use a Touch UI. THIS DOESN'T WORK! Apple also doesn't use MacOSX on the iPad and normal Mac If I can't turn this crap in the RTM off, I don't use Windows 8. That's simple

Renaming the shsxs.dll fixes it in the Developer Preview. I have the old/1000 times faster Windows 7 Startmenu back + all improvements from the Windows 8 kernel + Hyper-V. This is what I wanted for Windows 7 and now I have it after 2 years

This post has been edited by MagicAndre1981: 15 September 2011 - 09:07 AM

[Tripredacus]

I could definately see a lot of us waiting for Server 8 to use instead of Windows 8 on our desktops.

[MagicAndre1981]

Server 8 has it, too

http://www.neowin.ne...s--what039s-new

[Tripredacus]

What about the third (features) option?

Or worst case, there may end up being a bunch of threads on how to modify your Windows 8 to have the Windows 7 features, similar to what you have done... Presuming such things will work by that point.

[Mr Snrub]

I've only played briefly with the client and server in VMs, but the jury is still out on the Metro interface right now... however as a Windows Phone 7 user I'm probably a bit more inclined to accept it as a Good Thing™ before the majority.

It did take me a long time to stop immediately reverting to "classic start menu" mode on XP, but I got to use the "libraries" feature of Windows 7 a lot more quickly, so I'm less of a luddite these days

I do like the idea of chrome-less apps, including the web browser, filling the screen... but I have to wonder if my working style will need to change (even with 2 screens, I have a lot of not-quite-maximized windows that overlap).


I love the file copy process dialogue boxes with the current & historical throughput, with ability to pause, and the new Task Manager is very cool.

Built-in opening/mounting of ISOs and VHD through the shell is very handy and time saving for my kind of work.

Hyper-V in the x64 client is a welcome addition, I know a lot of people have been wanting to run 64-bit VMs on laptopes without needing to install Server and losing all the power features - though the SLAT-enabled CPU requirement might throw a few people.


There will undoubtedly be plenty of "so, where did they put the... ahhh, there it is..." moments in my future

[cluberti]

MagicAndre1981, on 15 September 2011 - 09:05 AM, said:

This teletubby style is nothing for me. For a touch monitor it is nice, but not for a Desktop PC with mouse/keyboard. MSFT made the mistake several years to force tablet users to run a non touch UI, now they force the PCs users to use a Touch UI. THIS DOESN'T WORK! Apple also doesn't use MacOSX on the iPad and normal Mac If I can't turn this crap in the RTM off, I don't use Windows 8. That's simple

In all seriousness, you should use what works for you, but Microsoft is betting that PCs will become mostly obsolete in the coming years, and they are probably correct. Consumers buy more tablets and iPads than ever before, and Microsoft's sales of Windows are stagnant (PCs). Given that tablet-style devices are really still in their infancy, once they become more mature (and an OS like this is sure to help that along), I'm guessing developers will end up needing to learn how to use the new UI (c'mon, it's not that bad - if you stop thinking in old Start Menu terms, it does work), or stick with unsupported software. I would be surprised if there's not a way to disable that in RTM, but I've been wrong before...

For what it's worth, I spend my days going to customer sites and seeing how users are migrating IT first-hand, and tablets are the thing. If Microsoft can get on that, they will save the company's bottom line (and make a whole host of very large customers very happy). If they don't do this, Apple will get a larger foothold in enterprises worldwide, moreso than they already have, and Android devices won't be far behind. Like it or not, this is the future. I for one would rather have a PC in tablet form than a toy.

[MagicAndre1981]

cluberti, on 15 September 2011 - 10:54 AM, said:

Consumers buy more tablets and iPads than PCs now, and they're still in their infancy - once they become more mature (and an OS like this is sure to help that along), I'm guessing developers will end up needing to learn how to use the new UI, or stick with unsupported software.

This is ok, but I'M DESKTOP USER, NO TABLET USER!!!!. I DON'T WANT IT ON MY DESKTOP, because I have NO benefit from the new UI, ONLY DISADVANTAGES. For tablets with touch hardware (http://msdn.microsof...v=vs.85%29.aspx) the new UI can be enabled by default, but NOT for home users on desktops.

Why is this always so complicated to implement options in MS tools? Also the useless ribbon in the Explorer uses too much space. Only 10% used the command bar and most users have 768 pixels, so MS wasted the valuably vertical space. Option to disable it? No! Well done! I hope you can see my sarcasm.

The look of the Win7 Explorer + the removed functions from Vistas Explorer and TABS would be nice to have in Windows 8. Those are required improvements, not this teletubby UI.

[cluberti]

First, be calm - this is a developer preview, not a full build. It's in tablet form now, probably because the kinds of things OEMs and developers will need to focus on will be tablet-style hardware and the new Metro UI for applets (desktop PCs and apps are, as expected, kind of mature at this point in history ). From all we've heard so far, defaulting to the desktop app will be possible, and we've not heard definitively on the start menu being totally gone or not (it's possible either way). Rant on the blog, but considering it's not even a beta yet, I wouldn't get too worked up.

[Mr Snrub]

MagicAndre1981, on 15 September 2011 - 11:23 AM, said:

This is ok, but I'M DESKTOP USER, NO TABLET USER!!!!. I DON'T WANT IT ON MY DESKTOP, because I have NO benefit from the new UI, ONLY DISADVANTAGES. For tablets with touch hardware (http://msdn.microsof...v=vs.85%29.aspx) the new UI can be enabled by default, but NOT for home users on desktops.

Conversely, a consistent interface is a big bonus for developers (and ultimately users) - they can be device-agnostic and get a predictable user experience (if you've ever tried web development you understand the pain of trying to get a standard look across machines with different resolutions, aspects, browsers, etc.).

I would assume there'll be a method to disable Metro, or at least have the classic desktop experience as the default, but it's early days yet.
(I was kind of surprised myself to see the Server had the Metro interface out of the box too.)

MagicAndre1981, on 15 September 2011 - 11:23 AM, said:

Why is this always so complicated to implement options in MS tools? Also the useless ribbon in the Explorer uses too much space. Only 10% used the command bar and most users have 768 pixels, so MS wasted the valuably vertical space. Option to disable it? No! Well done! I hope you can see my sarcasm.

The ribbons have auto-hide if the space is an issue - and "swiping" bars/charms in with Windows 8 is a more practical method of getting access to uncommonly-used icons, instead of having them pop-up unexpectedly with a mouseover.


The user experience & interface evolves and adapts to demands - from the DOS prompt up to MS-DOS 6.22, Program Manager in Windows 3.x, various 3rd party "docks" for Windows 3.x (I used HP's Dashboard in the early 90's), the Start menu appearance with Windows 95 and its subsequent reinventions in XP (which at the time was also dubbed "Teletubby UI" ), Vista and 7.

Software does, on occasion, require reinvention, or we'd all still be using command-line OS's (and consider running DOSKEY.COM a hack), editing documents with vi or EDIT.COM.

[GrofLuigi]

It must be said...

[Tripredacus]

Bring back Reversi for RTM?