Jump to content

Welcome to MSFN Forum
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. This message will be removed once you have signed in.
Login to Account Create an Account



Photo

Windows 8 - Deeper Impressions


  • Please log in to reply
6135 replies to this topic

#1626
JorgeA

JorgeA

    FORMAT B: /V /S

  • MSFN Sponsor
  • 3,225 posts
  • Joined 08-April 10
  • OS:Vista Home Premium x64
  • Country: Country Flag

Now that Tihiy's brought back the Start Menu and bigmuscle's bringing back the Aero in Windows 8...this OS might become usable. :D
Just like tune-up cars. Everyone wanted LED headlights and now the car manufacturers are offering that. Some put up a rear-view camera for better parking and now it's available for general public a.s.o. Windows 8 is going on the same road. :D

I think MS is re-thinking its marketing strategy.

Staying in the aumotive analogy: what's happened is that, by leaving out factory parts that a lot of customers want (Start Button/Menu, Aero Glass, etc.), Microsoft has given a boost to the aftermarket. ;)

Unfortunately, that screeching noise known as Metro/Modern UI is factory-installed and (AFAIK) can't be removed or switched out for something better. (Although it looks like Tihiy has covered up the noise pretty well with StartIsBack.)

But maybe they'll take a hint from the auto industry and bake features like Aero Glass and the Start Menu back into Win8 (or 9).

--JorgeA

Edited by JorgeA, 26 January 2013 - 10:59 AM.



How to remove advertisement from MSFN

#1627
Win2k3EE

Win2k3EE

    Member

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 222 posts
  • Joined 15-May 05

But maybe they'll take a hint from the auto industry and bake features like Aero Glass and the Start Menu back into Win8 (or 9).


I really hope so.

#1628
CharlotteTheHarlot

CharlotteTheHarlot

    MSFN Master

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,054 posts
  • Joined 24-September 07
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag

They are now demanding the kill-off of the desktop outright!

...

These dolts are worse than Sinofsky and Ballmer.

Isn't it stunning? In my 2nd comment on this very thread ( see Post #417 ) I noticed this very insanity. Our so-called allies have become the very iSheep they claim to despise and never miss a chance to ridicule in every comment section. It is the most blatant case of cognitive dissonance imaginable. But they are far, far, far worse than those stereotyped iSheep.

Something occurred during the Vista debacle I think. I remember at first there was some friendly debate on the official Vista Team Blog during the beta phase. And then suddenly the issue of DRM and protected content path burst into the spotlight, sides were drawn, Microsoft hunkered down into a bunker mentality and and the baby sheep ( MicroLambs? ) were already saying stuff like: 'go ahead Microsodt, do it to us!'. In amazement I watched a grass roots groundswell of anti-Microsoft and anti-Vista sites and memes sprout up ( BadVista, VistaSucks, F*ckVista, etc ) . Then we saw the cynical and self-serving Mojave Experiment from Microsoft. But what I didn't notice was the breadth of the astroturfing campaign. By accident or design they nurtured these MicroLambs into MicroSheep and here we are.

I'm from the old days, I remember Microsoft before they got into Operating Systems and Apple when they were still competing with Commodore and Atari in a very small and new field. When IBM dropped its nuclear bomb with their PC and the "Little Tramp" Charlie Chaplin things began to move into the general publics' eye and the early battle lines were drawn between the open PC ( mostly IBM ) and proprietary Apple. The common perception is that Apple nurtured a radical unkempt base of loyal rabid fans made up of artists and musicians while IBM and Microsoft nurtured a following of uptight conservative business types ( and yes, this is decades before "I'm a Mac, I'm A PC" ). In my experience this view was pretty accurate to a point. I interacted with the "enemy", having many creative friends that only would use Macs, however there was no personal animosity that I can recall. Most of it was directly due to the Apple commercials and other things emanating out of Cupertino. IBM and Apple were certainly competitors to an extent, but there was much less potential customer overlap than people like to believe. Most Apple users would not buy IBM because they were not looking for DOS or Quasi-DOS command line applications preferring the more object oriented WYSIWYG approach from Apple. On the other hand we business types would rather be stuck with DOS and its 1000:1 ratio of applications compared to Macs and were happy to dispense with the frills to get the job done. It was classic Style versus Substance. In truth, IBM and their clones on one side and Apple on the other had the entire 1980's to their respective fan bases and customers all to themselves, a clear playing field. And it should be pointed out here that Microsoft played both sides effectively, supplying critical applications to Apple which in my opinion saved the company several times by giving them some credibility in the business arena, but not quite enough to make them a serious player in the market. Mac versions of Word and Excel and some other things sufficed for small or home business environments, but they were not enough to touch enterprise or even the average office. In fact I'm not sure that Apple ever really tried to become a business computer company at all ( they would run petty ads making fun of the competition and their user base rather than ads that showed a Mac doing everything a PC-AT could do and more ).

The 1990's with Windows 3.x and 9x brought the direct conflict, the look and feel issues, the ill will. Still I cannot recall Microsoft or any other of the "good guys" attacking Apple or evangelizing like we see today. We were too busy criticizing Microsoft and the OEMs for dragging their feet and not giving us what Apple had long had, a stable OS with a usable GUI. It wouldn't be until after 2000 that the PC and Macs were truly interchangeable IMHO, and even then the application ratio was still 1000:1 comparing PC to Mac. Apple continued with the cynical ads and I have no doubt that this ticked off lots of PC users, because it makes no sense to insult your potential customers. Even though Microsoft had long been on the receiving end of these insulting ad campaigns they failed to see this obvious mistake. Fast forward to recent Vista and current events and they have perfectly copied the obnoxious arrogant attitude that had long existed in Cupertino headquarters ( but not necessarily in the minds of Mac users ). The stunning thing to me is just how fast this occurred. We're talking perhaps 6 years total for Microsoft to create a rabid and retarded chorus of fanboys that clearly surpasses anything that the Apple amen-chorus ever did. It's not even a close call. Our so-called "friends" are the real creeps now. They are enablers of the worst kind, even demanding that Microsoft destroy Windows and become MicroApple right before our eyes. 'Please kill Windows, all its legacy, all its utility, all its customizability, all its history. Do this so that we can have childish consumer consumption appliances to play Angry Birds and Cut The Rope, and tweet on Twitter and stalk on Facebook. While you're at it, please give us Playskool and Romper Room little colored blocks so we can relive our childhoods.'

Who is to blame? Ballmer and Gates I think. Ballmer because he is a lifelong under-achiever and a classic product of the Peter Principle, and Gates because he lost his programming mojo long ago and after reading books about Carnegie and Nobel decided to spend his time buying himself a reputation. The Vanity Fair story offers one glimpse of the Microsoft disaster, and the Mini-Microsoft blog fills in some of the blanks in those comments by Softies and ex-Softies. There is no lofty goal there, no pretense of perfectionism, just pure business and marketing from a company that is a mere shell of the original. I'm not sure Gates and Allen ever had lofty goals anyway, but I believe that many of the 1980's and later programmers did. Unfortunately the crew cannot prevent the Titanic from crashing into an Iceberg if the Captain and first mate decide to race full steam ahead despite all warnings.

How did it happen? Well again, all over this thread we have long expressed the obvious that Microsoft, in particular Ballmer has a childish case of both Google-envy and Apple-envy. It is the most basest of instincts, jealousy. The "Lost Decade" article describes it well, especially the Google angle with throwing chairs: "He threw a chair against the wall. “F*cking Eric Schmidt is a f*cking p*ssy!” Ballmer yelled, according to the court document. “I’m going to f*cking bury that guy! I have done it before and I will do it again. I’m going to f*cking kill Google.”". Now if you realize that sometime after that craziness while Ballmer is fixated on Google ( and almost dumped $45 billion to buy Yahoo! ), Apple comes along and drops the iMacs, MacBooks, iPods, iPhones, and iPads onto the marketplace and gobbles up all the pent-up customer base while fathead is still obsessing over the other guy. This caused even more fury, more envy, more jealousy. Ballmer cracked at this point I believe and just decided to give in to Apple-envy and become MicroApple by copying every single thing he could copy. Obviously him ( and Gates ) should have been removed in the Google-envy period, but the stock market is comprised of idi0ts if you watch the analysts and the day-to-day happenings. They are oblivious to these facts.

This, I believe is where we come in. Speaking for myself, I avoided the Apple-universe precisely because it was an arrogant, petty, locked-down walled-garden model of shallow consumerism. Ballmer's moves can only offend those on the "PC side" who have a moral compass, value freedom of choice, and possess personal integrity. I see his actions as a direct attack on me, no different than the cynical Cupertino ads of the past. They are similar because they are really the same. Earlier I said: "Steve Jobs did not die, he is haunting the halls of Microsoft possessing the body of Sinofsky". Actually he is possessing all of their management upper levels, Gates, Ballmer, Julie, Jensen and others. This is exactly why there is such an outcry these days. Many people see what is happening. Some fixate on the Start Menu, others on Aero Glass, others on the Store, others on UEFI, but it is all part and parcel of the big picture, Microsoft's cynical move to become Apple and believing they can just sheppard us along like a herd of mSheep. Ballmer is so thick headed he ignores others like Electronic Arts and Sony ( to name just a couple ) that took a giant crap on their veteran users and loyal customers at his own peril. What is most offensive to me is the attempt to cash in on their near total monopoly of x86 computers, folks that mostly did not ask for Windows but got it by default due to their OEM backroom maneuvers, a grand scheme to convert this current and future captive audience to their own private field of cows to be milked at will. They should be broken up just for this alone.

So back to the mSheep. These are the enablers. For every drunk or drug abuser out there you will find enablers that shirk their responsibility and scratch their heads when the subject wraps their car around a tree later. NeoWin and The Verge are over-run by them these days, largely because the operators ( yeah, I mean you Steven ) would rather enjoy large click counts than take a firm stand on integrity. Whatever. So lots of us that were there from the early days just left. You cannot argue with children ( they have no faculty for logic ) or the wild-eyed Windows 8 and Metro religious cult evangelists ( they've been saved and are headed for the promised land of good and plenty Angry Birds ). But we can scorn them and ridicule them. And when they help Microsoft complete their slow steady march to corporate suicide we can criticize them for accomplishing what Steve Jobs could never even dream of doing in his own lifetime.

It may now be inevitable because when you have an amen chorus supporting every move no matter how insane, the ability to effect course correction is overwhelmed by sheer momentum. But we can still try. Hey, at least there is entertainment value in this. I am really hoping that Microsoft adjusts their plan and restores the Start Menu just so we can watch fanboy heads exploding at those forums. If that happens it will be easy to push them over the ledge into complete insanity. :lol:

... Let him who hath understanding reckon the Number Of The Beast ...


#1629
Kelsenellenelvian

Kelsenellenelvian

    WPI Guru

  • Developer
  • 8,823 posts
  • Joined 18-September 03
  • OS:Windows 7 x64
  • Country: Country Flag
I have a friend that owns one of the 3 pc retailers and repair shops in town and was talking with her about win8.

While they are not out right declaring war on win8 they have been inundated with people wanting to downgrade....

They also highly suggest to people who are buying new pcs to go custom built and stay with win7.

#1630
ciHnoN

ciHnoN

    Member

  • Banned
  • PipPip
  • 153 posts
  • Joined 22-January 13
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag

Donator

Enablers indeed... and fools. These are not citizens or people in my humble opinion. They are empty shells. They are no longer "human". What the big corporation sais, they will do. What TV sais, they will do. What gets advertised, they will buy and love. It's really that simple.

Here is another moron from Channel 9...

http://channel9.msdn...6bba15201468d7c

That's already possible in Windows8. You just go here: http://www.stardock....roducts/start8/ and click install.

In many respects, Stardock actually solved this whole problem for Microsoft. Instead of Microsoft having to build a supported dual-start-menu to help people transition, Stardock have done it for them. This alleviates Microsoft of the need to test, localize, support, maintain and configure the app for the next decade, just in order to help people with the transition from a start menu to a start screen.

The default for Windows8 is great for "normal" users, but for the folks where losing the start menu is non-negotiable, they can upgrade to Windows8 and get Stardock. From Microsoft's perspective this is great!



His post is almost creepy. He actually recommends "Just go get Start8" and at the same time praises this abomination Windows 8. *lol*

The removal of start menu was a genius move. It distracted people SO MUCH and they all forgot about the locked boots and walled garden. Amazing isn't it? :}

EDIT: I personally actually only use Opera and Outlook. Sometimes Skype/RadioIO/Spotify and for work, Visual Studio. I'm glad I never got addicted to software in a way I get locked into one OS. It seems that soon, I will be running some BSD version. I can do without Outlook. I'll be OK without Skype/RadioIO/Spotify... a virtual machine for VS and I'll be set. Basically, what Ballmer is doing is to force people like me away from Windows. I really did love Windows before Windows 8. Never thought I would be looking for options to leave it. What little I need in Windows can be virtualized, out of sight... and out of mind.

Edited by ciHnoN, 26 January 2013 - 02:46 PM.

He who laughs has not yet heard the bad news.

#1631
submix8c

submix8c

    Inconceivable!

  • Patrons
  • 4,331 posts
  • Joined 14-September 05
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag
From everything I've found about Win8, it's built for the "consumer". It reminds me of The Galactic Empire Trilogy (Isaac Asimov).
-----
"All right. Suppose I were to blast a vital part into nothingness? I suppose the machines aren't immune to nuclear forces? Suppose I fuse a vital connection, or smash a quartz D-tube?"
"Well, then," shouted the tech-man, furiously, "you would be killed."
"Yes, I know that," Mallow was shouting, too, "but what about the generator? Could you repair it?"
"Sir," the tech-man howled his words, "you have had a fair return. You've had what you asked for. Now get out! I owe you nothing more!"
Mallow bowed with a satiric respect and left.
-----
Summary - "dumbed-down" to the point where nobody will understand it but everyone will use it because they're (willingly) forced to but if it breaks, eventually nobody can fix it. But that's OK... "Oooh! SHINY and PRETTY!".

Someday the tyrants will be unthroned... Jason "Jay" Chasteen; RIP, bro!

Posted Image


#1632
TELVM

TELVM

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 303 posts
  • Joined 09-February 12
  • OS:Windows 7 x64
  • Country: Country Flag
Man I just can't stand all this 'eightard' nonsense about an interface being 'obsolete' just because it's not 'fresh today'.

If an interface works fine, it works fine, and until someone invents something REALLY TRULY better, professionals stick to it not giving a s*** if it was invented yesterday or a century ago.


The Red Baron's Fokker Triplane, 1917:

Posted Image


Eurofighter Typhoon, 2013:

Posted Image





You seriously mess with that, be prepared for royal aborted take-offs and crashes ...

Posted Image



#1633
ciHnoN

ciHnoN

    Member

  • Banned
  • PipPip
  • 153 posts
  • Joined 22-January 13
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag

Donator

From http://channel9.msdn...ows-8-copypaste

does anyone know of a way to copy and paste in windows 8? I have been scanning in recipes and stuff that I lost in my old computer from superstorm sandy and although they are going into a folder on my new computer, I can't find a way to copy and paste them into my new recipe program, I've tried everything, I'm so upset I wasted my money on this computer I hate windows 8 it wont let you do anything like 7 or xp did


@vseawitch: Windows 8 deprecated the "C" and "V" keys from the keyboard so you're out of luck. Sorry.



hahahhahhhahhaa... they are removing EVERYTHING from Windows it seems. The future: "Hello, this is TV Windows. You have a limited number of TV-channels applications Apps with limited functionality to use. You may only use these pre-approved ones which only we allow you to use. You may not install from any other source than our pre-selected walled garden. It is of course for your own security."

Edited by ciHnoN, 27 January 2013 - 10:00 AM.

He who laughs has not yet heard the bad news.

#1634
jaclaz

jaclaz

    The Finder

  • Developer
  • 14,584 posts
  • Joined 23-July 04
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag
That seems like a (bad) joke.
However:
http://www.veodin.co...orer-shortcuts/

Windows 8 Explorer Shortcuts

Windows 8 has recently been released and, of course, KeyRocket supports all the keyboard shortcuts available in the latest Microsoft Operating System. Check out all of the new Windows 8 shortcuts.

So as you browse our Shortcut Database, keep in mind that there is an easier way!

KeyRocket, our shortcut notification app, teaches you the shortcuts that you need. While you are working, KeyRocket analyses your mouse movements and suggests time-saving Windows 8 shortcuts via a small notification window in the corner of your screen. KeyRocket keeps track of your progress and only displays notifications for key sequences that you haven’t learned yet, so it never interrupts your work. :)

KeyRocket offers a unique solution to an old problem; memorizing lists of Windows 8 shortcuts downloaded from websites like this. With KeyRocket you will soon master Windows 8 and become the most productive person in your office.

KeyRocket also supports Windows 8, 7, XP and Vista as well as MS Office Suite 2007 and 2010 (Excel, Word, Outlook, PowerPoint). In all that’s about 1,700 shortcuts.

CTRL+C and CTRL+V are there allright.


jaclaz

#1635
Win2k3EE

Win2k3EE

    Member

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 222 posts
  • Joined 15-May 05
OMG!OMG!OMG! They removed Ctrl+C & Ctrl+V? :blink: :blink: :blink:

Well, now It's official. Balmer & co. are nuts. They must be locked up under adult supervision.

#1636
MagicAndre1981

MagicAndre1981

    after Windows 7 GA still Vista lover :)

  • Patrons
  • 6,093 posts
  • Joined 28-August 05
  • OS:Vista Ultimate x86
  • Country: Country Flag

Donator

for me they work in Explorer. Maybe they refer to the new apps.
Posted Image

#1637
JorgeA

JorgeA

    FORMAT B: /V /S

  • MSFN Sponsor
  • 3,225 posts
  • Joined 08-April 10
  • OS:Vista Home Premium x64
  • Country: Country Flag

for me they work in Explorer. Maybe they refer to the new apps.

I have a suspicion that the bit about Ctrl-C and Ctrl-V was a joke -- made plausible by the fact that they HAVE taken out so much other functionality.

--JorgeA

#1638
JorgeA

JorgeA

    FORMAT B: /V /S

  • MSFN Sponsor
  • 3,225 posts
  • Joined 08-April 10
  • OS:Vista Home Premium x64
  • Country: Country Flag

Man I just can't stand all this 'eightard' nonsense about an interface being 'obsolete' just because it's not 'fresh today'.

If an interface works fine, it works fine, and until someone invents something REALLY TRULY better, professionals stick to it not giving a s*** if it was invented yesterday or a century ago.


The Red Baron's Fokker Triplane, 1917:

FABULOUS illustration of the idea!! :thumbup

But then... don't you realize that that airplane interface is "cheesy and dated"? They do need to get with the times and devise a "Modern" design for cockpit controls. I suggest reversing the location of the throttle and center sticks, and then hiding the throttle under a lid that pops open with a heel kick. The pilot can discover the lid if he happens to trip over his seat.

Same thing with all those distracting dials and buttons, we need a chrome-free surface. Make them discoverable by bumping your head on the ceiling.

--JorgeA

Edited by JorgeA, 27 January 2013 - 02:23 PM.


#1639
TELVM

TELVM

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 303 posts
  • Joined 09-February 12
  • OS:Windows 7 x64
  • Country: Country Flag

... I suggest reversing the location of the throttle ...


Interestingly, the French did exactly that in their pre World War 2 fighters. While in almost every other air force in Europe and in the USA you opened throttle by pushing forward the lever, the same action in a french fighter would CLOSE the throttle.

By hazards of war some of those french fighters ended up in the british RAF ... with predictable results: " ... Curtiss manufactured P-40 types for France which were later taken over by the British as Tomahawk Is and used for training. In one oft-told instance, a British pilot realized he was landing long, pushed the throttle to the firewall ... and the aircraft stalled and pancaked into a hangar. He climbed out, saying: "No wonder the bloody Frogs lost the war!".


That you better don't mess with the interface lesson was learnt, and all post World War 2 french aircraft have 'forwards' throttle.

#1640
ciHnoN

ciHnoN

    Member

  • Banned
  • PipPip
  • 153 posts
  • Joined 22-January 13
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag

Donator

These airplane examples are hilarious yet perfect! Now if someone could get that into the head of those morons at Microsoft who gave a go on Windows 8.

Although, all this makes me even more sure now, that they knew exactly what they were doing when changing and messing around with the interface like that. It's to throw everyone off their game, so much so that everyone forget about the lock-in walled garden which is in place, where MS is now doing an Apple with almost no one noticing it.

You see, you have to distract the sheeples mushroom people.

Why I use mushroom people instead? Well, because they are kept in the dark and fed manure. Which is exactly what is coming out of MS. :ph34r: :puke:



Edited by ciHnoN, 28 January 2013 - 02:51 AM.

He who laughs has not yet heard the bad news.

#1641
jaclaz

jaclaz

    The Finder

  • Developer
  • 14,584 posts
  • Joined 23-July 04
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag
One of the pillars in the study of ergonomics is this book by Donald Norman:
http://en.wikipedia....Everyday_Things
http://en.wikipedia....i/Donald_Norman

The main idea is "affordance" of objects with which you interact.
http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Affordance
A plate on a door "affords" to be pushed, it is like it is shouting "hey, push me", a round bar, of a suitable diameter and length "affords" to be gripped by the hand, it's like shouting "hey grip me", etc.

Besides the fact that the only thing the NCI "affords" is to be switched off, do check page #29 on google book's preview:
http://books.google....epage&q&f=false

There is a clear example about the "generic risk" the MS guys are taking :ph34r:.

jaclaz

#1642
Formfiller

Formfiller

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 490 posts
  • Joined 03-January 13
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag
Hey:

http://gallery.techn...artLog-37c8111d

MS has released this Powershell script. (although unofficial etc.)

In Windows 8, without a Start button, properly shutting down or rebooting Windows can be a bit of a chore. Many users want to shut down or reboot Windows in just one click. This script enables users to click on a tile to shut down, reboot or log off Windows on the Start menu.


Actually the script creates the links on the start screen, not start menu.. but still they wrote "chore" in relation to W8 here.

First signs of sanity?

Edited by Formfiller, 28 January 2013 - 09:32 AM.


#1643
Tripredacus

Tripredacus

    K-Mart-ian Legend

  • Super Moderator
  • 9,913 posts
  • Joined 28-April 06
  • OS:Server 2012
  • Country: Country Flag

Donator

Actually the script creates the links on the start screen, not start menu.. but still they wrote "chore" in relation to W8 here.

First signs of sanity?


I've read multiple articles from MS that refer to the Start Screen as the Start Menu. I think its just an error.
MSFN RULES | GimageX HTA for PE 3-5 | lol probloms
msfn2_zpsc37c7153.jpg

#1644
ciHnoN

ciHnoN

    Member

  • Banned
  • PipPip
  • 153 posts
  • Joined 22-January 13
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag

Donator

For short term Win8 Desktop relief ...

Just found this tip posted to emulate 'boot to desktop' in Win8... http://www.dirkstrau...ws-8-in-desktop

Will try it out as a short-term workaround ...

Herbie


haha even them folks at Channel9 are starting to realize it posting how-to on skipping the start screen.
Meanwhile... http://www.neowin.ne...hromebook-sales "Acer: Windows 8 "still not successful"; hypes "amazing" Chromebook sales" ...not that Chromebook is any better but yeah... funny nevertheless. :D

Quote from the article: Bloomberg reports that Acer had a 28 percent drop in its PC shipments for the fourth quarter of 2012 compared to a year ago. Wong added, "Windows 8 itself is still not successful ... The whole market didn’t come back to growth after the Windows 8 launch, that’s a simple way to judge if it is successful or not."



:angel

Edited by ciHnoN, 28 January 2013 - 11:05 AM.

He who laughs has not yet heard the bad news.

#1645
Formfiller

Formfiller

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 490 posts
  • Joined 03-January 13
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag
Those Neowin comments are always a fountain of hilarity.

In the Vista days I actually defended MS and thought the hate on Vista was totally overblown. Mostly because the criticisms of it were in part completely overblown - like the claim that it cannot play self-recorded MP3s due to DRM and stuff like that. The DRM issue was for the most part just scare (it only came into play with blu-ray and HD-DVD as far as I know. And MS did a terrible job explaining that).

Windows 8 though - that's a real stinker.

Anyway, what I wanted to say is that to me, the other people who didn't flip out over Vista back in the days seemed to be quite reasonable. It's really sad that some of them have apparently converted to a full blown metro-cult now.

Edited by Formfiller, 28 January 2013 - 12:32 PM.


#1646
CharlotteTheHarlot

CharlotteTheHarlot

    MSFN Master

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,054 posts
  • Joined 24-September 07
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag

Meanwhile... http://www.neowin.ne...hromebook-sales "Acer: Windows 8 "still not successful"; hypes "amazing" Chromebook sales" ...not that Chromebook is any better but yeah... funny nevertheless. :D

I see the children have been busy in that thread posting a hundred mindless comments already. I wish Acer and other OEMs ( that means you too Dell ) read through the stench emanating from the Windows 8 religious cult. Microsoft has really poisoned the customer well in ways that even Apple could not. Get on the wrong side of this cult and they will brutalize you.

The newest NeoWin article up there ...

Windows 8 has surpassed OS X Mountain Lion in market share ( NeoWin 2013-01-28 )

... is a marvel of optimistic desperation. The chart ...

Posted Image


... has them all giddy. But look close, we could also caption it as: "Windows 8 has surpassed 'Other' in market share" :lol:

Nevermind the most important fact that Mac OS is not available for anything other than Apple hardware ( save for the few brave Hackintosh tinkerers ). This business that Microsoft Windows competes with Apple's Mac OS is utterly ridiculous, and as I've always said, it allows the Windows 8 cultist to ignore previous versions of Windows ( the true competitor ) when comparing operating systems and thus avoid all criticism of missing and broken features in a declining product. In short, using Mac OS as a foil clears a path for Windows to be destroyed from within.

Microsoft and their Windows 8 religious cultists better be careful though. Apple could at anytime renounce their unwritten treaty with Microsoft and simply release Mac OS into the wild for any and all x86 hardware. At that point, many will be trying it out and a good number of them might just stay ( not me personally, but those mSheep that really desire to become iSheep ).


EDIT: updated image URL, and again

Edited by CharlotteTheHarlot, 06 May 2013 - 07:36 AM.

... Let him who hath understanding reckon the Number Of The Beast ...


#1647
Formfiller

Formfiller

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 490 posts
  • Joined 03-January 13
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag

At that point, many will be trying it out and a good number of them might just stay ( not me personally, but those mSheep that really desire to become iSheep ).


I hate to say that, but the iSheep prospect doesn't look so bad now, at least on the deskop. The Mac Appstore offers the real deal applications, not crApps like W8. And "sideloading" is still possible. And although I don't like the OSX GUI paradigm that much, it's miles above failtro.

If Apple would release OSX for PCs, and Microsoft won't correct course, I will say goodbye to Windows. I never thought Apple would be more "free" and less fanboy infested than MS..

What's your take on this?

Edited by Formfiller, 28 January 2013 - 12:54 PM.


#1648
Formfiller

Formfiller

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 490 posts
  • Joined 03-January 13
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag
New Neowin comments!

http://www.neowin.ne...romebook-family

And games, LOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOL

Games !!! LOLOLOLLOLOLOL

Chromebook has no games, so funny LOL


I am pretty sure these guys discuss Dostoevsky and Wittgenstein in their off-time.

As MS tries to get the average price for PC hardware to go higher so OEMs can actually make more money they seem to still be stuck into this cheap as chips mentality that does nothing but eat into profits.


Yeah, because everyone is rich! Why do companies have financial problems anyway? Not making enough money? Raise prices threefold. Problems solved.

#1649
CharlotteTheHarlot

CharlotteTheHarlot

    MSFN Master

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,054 posts
  • Joined 24-September 07
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag

What's your take on this?

I would install it on one computer just for educational purposes. If it were to take off among my clientèle I would be forced to learn something about it.

I have enough Windows installs to last forever. I've been saving the licenses from retired computers, collecting them from others, in short, I am really not worried. If we can bust this Microsoft antirust monopoly and get the OEMs to simply write generic drivers for all Windows we could go on forever. This might require resurrecting the earlier driver SDKs and hammering out some drivers ourselves. But it is too soon to tell what is going to happen. If there was a simple driver model which made the Windows version irrelevant we would already have new hardware and drivers that worked on almost any previous Windows. Now we know why they constantly and needlessly change things requiring a new set of drivers with each new printer or whatever. Planned obsolescence. You upgrade Windows to be able to run new hardware. You upgrade your hardware to run new Windows. This contradicts what an operating system is. You also upgrade your tools and compilers and SDKs to write the new drivers, etc. Wonderful scam they got there.

If I could wave a magic wand I would take the Windows 2K and / or XP source code and liberate it as GPL and also any related necessary patents like FAT and NTFS and USB and etc. This might sound far-fetched at the moment, but Microsoft's position as the supplier of the OS for 90% of all real computers is something far wider and more nefarious than anything John Rockefeller or J.P. Morgan ever had under their direct control. There is literally orders of magnitude of difference now. Microsoft could be broken up spinning off the OS div ( though I personally think they've already made too much money on this OS ) or the product can be taken away as a necessary public service. The old hypothetical question was 'If Standard Oil Microsoft were to press the off switch would the public suffer?' and the answer is obviously yes. Too much power in the hands of very erratic and self-serving management of highly questionable non-existing ethics.

Hopefully it wouldn't degenerate into a million Linux kernels though.

... Let him who hath understanding reckon the Number Of The Beast ...


#1650
jaclaz

jaclaz

    The Finder

  • Developer
  • 14,584 posts
  • Joined 23-July 04
  • OS:none specified
  • Country: Country Flag
Unless basic math has not been subverted lately - just for the record - being 2.45%=2.45% the condition is called "being equal" or "at the same level".
In plain English is something (that was at a lower level) gets to the same level of something else, you say "it has reached" not "it has surpassed".

Adding the "Windows Touch" (which should be RT) is a non-orthodox operation (and it hasn't been evidenced in the graph).
The actual source:
http://netmarketshar...0&qptimeframe=W
actually talks of "Windows 8 RT Touch" (this only shows how the good Neowin guys are not able to report correctly a string of text) BUT it has OBVIOUSLY mixed some data, as the report is titled:

Desktop Operating System Market Share

I have seen no desktops shipped with a senselessly underpowered ARM processor, but maybe I missed something? :unsure:

If the good guys @NetMarketShare believe in good faith that the Windows RT is a desktop operating system, they have however bigger problems than those Quality Assurance (see below) may fix . :ph34r:

Please note that if we use the same amount of illogical procedure, we can use the 0.02% reported for "Mac OS X (no version reported)" as counter balance for the 0.02% of senselessly inserted in the report for "Windows 8 RT Touch".

More generally citing a single report that has this text (top left):

This report contains preview data that has NOT been reviewed by Quality Assurance.

is not a good example of scientifical method.

If you check the view filtering for "DeviceType=All" aka "Operating System Market Share":
http://netmarketshar...me=W&qpcustomd=
Something interesting happens.
The Windows 8 RT Touch that had 0.02% in "Desktop Operating System Market Share" jumps up to 0.07% while Mac OS X 10.8 and Windows 8 that had BOTH 2.45% step down to 2.17%.
HOW can this happen (I mean IF data is real AND math is used correctly?) :w00t:
A given fixed amount divided by a larger number increases? :ph34r:

jaclaz

Edited by jaclaz, 28 January 2013 - 01:38 PM.





2 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 2 guests, 0 anonymous users