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Windows 8 - Deeper Impressions


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#2126
JorgeA

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Microsoft never professed to aiming for third place, but the article writer can't even remember to mention them (or Nokia) when talking about competitive smartphone manufacturers.

Wow, that tells you something, doesn't it. Microsoft doesn't rate even a mention in a discussion of the smartphone market.

--JorgeA


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#2127
JorgeA

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MICROSOFT SAYS GOOGLE ‘REFUSES’ YOUTUBE APP ACCESS TO WINDOWS PHONE USERS

I don't know enough about that issue to comment, but I have to wonder what relation it might have to the "Scroogled" campaign. The latter could be a reaction by Microsoft to Google's YouTube foot-dragging. For sure, "Scroogled" isn't giving the Google folks any warm, fuzzy feelings about helping out on the YouTube score.

--JorgeA

#2128
JorgeA

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Over here in Blighty, there is a weekly computer mag (Micro Mart) . This week's edition has an article about failed hardware,.

Guess what is the final "entity" ?

Microsoft Surface!!

OK they say it may be premature but the way Microsoft are not exactly shouting from the rafters speaks volumes

Thanks, I can't wait to see the article posted on their website. (At least, I couldn't find it.) I know that many publications hold off for a while before putting their paid print material online for free.

However, looking around the site I did find this interesting analysis.

Another issue for Windows 8 to overcome was the negative aura that started to circulate about the preview versions in respect of the interface, once called ‘Metro’. From the outset, lots of people didn’t like the most radical change that Microsoft made to the Windows model. It didn’t help that Microsoft didn’t really explain its thinking behind the tiled interface or how the ‘Metro’ side of the coin and the conventional desktop were designed to coexist. In fact, it now seems apparent that they’re not really made to cooperate on any level, and what Microsoft was offering was akin to having two operating systems on one computer. That’s confusing and people don’t see bewilderment as desirable.

(emphasis added)

--JorgeA

Edited by JorgeA, 02 March 2013 - 09:56 PM.


#2129
HalloweenDocument12

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what Microsoft was offering was akin to having two operating systems on one computer.


If Windows 8 is less disorienting than a virtual machine, it's only slightly so.

#2130
JorgeA

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I just came across this thread on another forum, discussing Windows 8, and it provides a link to this provocative new article:

Windows 8 uptake falls even farther behind Vista

The whole article (which isn't all that long) is worth reading. A couple of highlights:

Windows 8's uptake pace slowed in February for the third straight month, an analytics company said today.

Windows 8's share increase in February was about four-tenths of a percentage point, smaller than January's gain, which in turn was smaller than either December's or November's.

The new operating system also fell further behind the pace set by Windows Vista in 2007: In its fourth month of availability, Vista powered approximately 4% of all Windows PCs. The full percentage point gap between Windows 8 and Vista was the largest so far in the tracking Computerworld has conducted.

(emphasis added)

--JorgeA

#2131
JorgeA

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How do other people (that means you who are reading this ;) ) come to visit the thread?


I take the lazy approach and enter the forum here, that always shows me all new posts that have occurred over a time frame I can choose, no matter where in the forum the posts are.

That's pretty neat. B) I didn't even know you could do that!

I come in mainly by getting automated notifications of new posts in the threads that I subscribe to, and secondarily by then looking around once I'm done with the new posts.

Your way should not make a difference which subforum the thread is in. As long as people keep posting, it'll keep showing up. :thumbup

--JorgeA


Yep, that's the idea. :)

Cheers and Regards

There IS one potential problem area, that I just realized. Anyone who would check the thread by browsing to the Windows 8 subforum (let's say, because they put the subforum in their Favorites) will now see the Deeper Impressions thread redirect sinking down the listingss, with the most recent post reported to be by Tripredacus on February 25. From that it's easy for a reader to conclude that there's nothing new and that the thread is dying, or has died.

I wonder what percentage of readers come into the forum that way. So the thread move could really put a crimp on the conversation here. Personally, when not coming directly to a thread via an e-mail notification, that IS the way that I browse MSFN: I go to the overall board index and go down the list of subforum names for areas of interest to me (Vista, Win9x, Security and Internet, etc.). I had never gone into the "General Discussion" subforum before this week!

Request to mods: is there any way to have that redirect provide the date and time of the most recent post in the continuing thread, as if it were a normal thread link?

--JorgeA

Edited by JorgeA, 03 March 2013 - 12:40 AM.


#2132
bphlpt

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Request to mods: is there any way to have that redirect provide the date and time of the most recent post in the continuing thread, as if it were a normal thread link?


Either that or sticky it, but I don't know if they can sticky a move notice.

Cheers and Regards

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#2133
bphlpt

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How do other people (that means you who are reading this ;) ) come to visit the thread?


I take the lazy approach and enter the forum here, that always shows me all new posts that have occurred over a time frame I can choose, no matter where in the forum the posts are.

That's pretty neat. B) I didn't even know you could do that!

I come in mainly by getting automated notifications of new posts in the threads that I subscribe to, and secondarily by then looking around once I'm done with the new posts.

Your way should not make a difference which subforum the thread is in. As long as people keep posting, it'll keep showing up. :thumbup

--JorgeA


Yep, that's the idea. :)

Cheers and Regards

There IS one potential problem area, that I just realized. Anyone who would check the thread by browsing to the Windows 8 subforum (let's say, because they put the subforum in their Favorites) will now see the Deeper Impressions thread redirect sinking down the listingss, with the most recent post reported to be by Tripredacus on February 25. From that it's easy for a reader to conclude that there's nothing new and that the thread is dying, or has died.

I wonder what percentage of readers come into the forum that way. So the thread move could really put a crimp on the conversation here. Personally, when not coming directly to a thread via an e-mail notification, that IS the way that I browse MSFN: I go to the overall board index and go down the list of subforum names for areas of interest to me (Vista, Win9x, Security and Internet, etc.). I had never gone into the "General Discussion" subforum before this week!

Request to mods: is there any way to have that redirect provide the date and time of the most recent post in the continuing thread, as if it were a normal thread link?

--JorgeA


See, that's the big advantage for using the "search active" type of link. You don't care where any thread is located. Any activity, even poll updates, to any thread in any subforum will show up. In fact, the only time I need to know where a thread is located is when I want to find an old thread that has not had any recent activity. And really I still don't need to know where it is because in that case I usually have to use the forum search function, or Google, to find it.

Cheers and Regards

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#2134
Formfiller

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The reason I don't participate much now, is because I have some time consuming stuff to do now, not so much the movement of the thread.

I for one think the thread should continue. If the reason for the initial closure was indeed due some influence of MS or someone working for them, then letting this thread die is exactly what they wanted.

#2135
jaclaz

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Hey guys, AGAIN, please, let's stop whining about nothing.
Nothing happened, nothing was censored, nothing was deleted, just §@ç#ing STOP whining and or suggest SENSELESS "conspiracy theories", THERE ARE SIMPLY NONE. :realmad:

If you want to know about a real censorship attack to freedom of speech coincidentally originated from Canada :w00t:, here is one example :ph34r: (and yes, this is OT ;)) :
http://www.npr.org/b...-words-on-menus

:lol:

The idea of menu police gnocching at your door well after midnight is appalling :ph34r:

jaclaz

P.S.: Still GREATLY OT, the way you present a menu may make a difference, compare.
http://news.national...-police-run-in/
Spoiler

with ;):
http://www.torontosu...e-after-another
Spoiler


And finally, for the record:
Spoiler

Edited by jaclaz, 03 March 2013 - 07:35 AM.


#2136
bpalone

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Hey guys, AGAIN, please, let's stop whining about nothing.
Nothing happened, nothing was censored, nothing was deleted, just §@ç#ing STOP whining and or suggest SENSELESS "conspiracy theories", THERE ARE SIMPLY NONE. :realmad:


I for one have enjoyed reading this thread. However, jaclaz is right. Nothing has happened except the thread was moved, so let's get back to discussing the topic of this thread and its drift thereof.

I am not a big Windows user, but I do still use it usually once or so a day, but nothing newer than XP, and that is if I have no other choice. Windows 2000 is my choice and will continue to be. But, I do have people ask me for advice from time to time and I feel that is important for me to keep up with developments so that I can deliver at least reasonably accurate advice. This thread has been a great help in that regard.

BUT LATELY, IT HAS LEFT ME A BIT UNSATISFIED IN THE QUEST FOR INFORMATION. :angry:

I do hope we can get back on track and that others will return and continue to contribute.

Thanks for putting up with my rant. I look forward to continuing to read this thread and maybe even contribute a little here and there.

#2137
Tripredacus

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I found something interesting on the TechNet forums:
http://social.techne...5b-031aebafecd9

Apparently, some users have found their OS to be de-activated while certain cellphones are plugged into the computer for charging. Only Samsungs... what a strange thing!
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#2138
GrofLuigi

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Microsoft Pulls the Plug on "Scroogled" Ads

I don't know how accurate it is, just thought I'd report it and contribute something to this thread I read and support. :thumbup

GL

Edited by GrofLuigi, 04 March 2013 - 03:11 PM.


#2139
JorgeA

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If you want to know about a real censorship attack to freedom of speech coincidentally originated from Canada :w00t:, here is one example :ph34r: (and yes, this is OT ;)) :
http://www.npr.org/b...-words-on-menus

Unbelievable!!

The idea of menu police gnocching at your door well after midnight is appalling :ph34r:

:lol:

Hey guys, AGAIN, please, let's stop whining about nothing.
Nothing happened, nothing was censored, nothing was deleted, just §@ç#ing STOP whining and or suggest SENSELESS "conspiracy theories", THERE ARE SIMPLY NONE. :realmad:

Personally, I don't think there was a conspiracy or an inside job or influence from outside. Although, for a while last Monday, the thread did get closed to new comments -- instead of simply relocated as it ultimately was. It was the drastic measure of closing the thread that gave rise to various theories about nefarious forces getting into the act.

Anyway, we did manage to bring it back to life and I'm glad that the discussion has resumed, although we do seem to have suffered significant casualties in terms of frequent thread posters.

I'm also DELIGHTED to see all the expressions of support in the last week from folks who've been mainly following the discussion without posting. It gives a sense of satisfaction to find out that we're providing something that people find valuable! :yes:

--JorgeA

#2140
JorgeA

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Word is getting out that Windows 8 hasn't done anything to stem the decline in PC sales (and may even be contributing to it):

Another Annual Decline for PC Sales

While it’s not as though anyone expected Microsoft’s Windows 8 to inject any real excitement into the consumer market, there were those who thought it might at least help to arrest the overall decline, especially among consumers. It wasn’t to be. Holiday season PC sales were disappointing, and the economic malaise, especially in Europe, weighed on corporate IT budgets. Shipments in the fourth quarter were down by 8.3 percent, which amounts to the worst holiday quarter on record, IDC says.

Meanwhile, emerging markets that once held the greatest potential for growth are flattening out, and some actually declined last year. They’ll start growing again this year, but only by a little through 2017. It was worse in the U.S., where shipments declined by 7.6 percent.

So the holiday quarter (i.e., when Win8 came out) is the worst one on record -- while emerging markets, instead of growing as anticipated, actually declined. Hmm... Not conclusive of course, but certainly suggestive.

--JorgeA

#2141
HalloweenDocument12

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While it’s not as though anyone expected Microsoft’s Windows 8 to inject any real excitement into the consumer market


They should define "anyone". Sure, while a likely minority realized long ago that Windows 8 was mediocre at best, the hype machine would have one believe that Windows 8 was enough to singlehandedly revive the flagging PC market. Don't take my word for it, they fooled the WSJ among others:

Permission to Procrastinate: Wait to Get a New Laptop

It's easy to say "No one listens to Mossberg" but I actually had to put up a fight over deploying Windows 7 due to his articles. I've made sure to rub it in now that my boss knows 8 is a dog.

In fairness to Walt, he gave a straight review upon release:

Walt Mossberg Reviews Windows 8

I think he initially advocated on the assumption that Microsoft knew what it was doing then later backpedaled once he realized how backwards it was. Maybe he assumed that the bugs would have been ironed out by release.

#2142
JorgeA

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I for one have enjoyed reading this thread. However, jaclaz is right. Nothing has happened except the thread was moved, so let's get back to discussing the topic of this thread and its drift thereof.

I am not a big Windows user, but I do still use it usually once or so a day, but nothing newer than XP, and that is if I have no other choice. Windows 2000 is my choice and will continue to be. But, I do have people ask me for advice from time to time and I feel that is important for me to keep up with developments so that I can deliver at least reasonably accurate advice. This thread has been a great help in that regard.

BUT LATELY, IT HAS LEFT ME A BIT UNSATISFIED IN THE QUEST FOR INFORMATION. :angry:

I do hope we can get back on track and that others will return and continue to contribute.

Thanks for putting up with my rant. I look forward to continuing to read this thread and maybe even contribute a little here and there.

Not a problem about the rant, that's what we're here for. ;)

Anything you get a chance to contribute will be welcome!

--JorgeA

#2143
JorgeA

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I found something interesting on the TechNet forums:
http://social.techne...5b-031aebafecd9

Apparently, some users have found their OS to be de-activated while certain cellphones are plugged into the computer for charging. Only Samsungs... what a strange thing!

That is incredibly bizarre.

Also opens up "interesting" new possibilities for messing with people's computers, if a way can be figured out to make that deactivation stick even after unplugging the phone. Or to deliberately make the same sort of nasty thing happen with other devices that normally get plugged into a PC. :o

--JorgeA

#2144
JorgeA

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Microsoft Pulls the Plug on "Scroogled" Ads

I don't know how accurate it is, just thought I'd report it and contribute something to this thread I read and support. :thumbup

GL

Thanks very much for the link! And of course for contributing...

Maybe Google offered to give Microsoft the same kind of treatment, based on the latter's own privacy record as we've seen in this thread.

--JorgeA

#2145
HalloweenDocument12

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Also from the link JorgeA posted:

One thing that might give the corporate market some badly needed pep: The end of support by Microsoft of Windows XP, which kicks in this year.


The writer was wise to qualify the statement with "corporate market". I think tech people are being unrealistic about the effect of XP's "expiration date" with respect to the consumer market. Some literally believe that it will evaporate the instant support ends, as if home users know or care about support periods. Hell, some of them will see it as an upgrade since their computer won't be at the Welcome screen every Wednesday morning when it automatically reboots while they're in the bathroom. XP is is going to be like a carton of eggs. Some people will toss it the day of the expiration date or even before. Others will continue using them until something bad happens, which probably won't happen even if they're weeks past their date.

#2146
SIW2

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Seventh comment on the link you provided is quite amusing

Windopia: A condition of acute technological nearsightedness resulting from a person's sole acquaintance to computing being through Microsoft Windows. Often accompanied by magical thinking regarding all products and pitches the company offers.





Microsoft Pulls the Plug on "Scroogled" Ads

I don't know how accurate it is, just thought I'd report it and contribute something to this thread I read and support. :thumbup

GL

Thanks very much for the link! And of course for contributing...

Maybe Google offered to give Microsoft the same kind of treatment, based on the latter's own privacy record as we've seen in this thread.

--JorgeA



#2147
JorgeA

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In fairness to Walt, he gave a straight review upon release:

Walt Mossberg Reviews Windows 8

I think he initially advocated on the assumption that Microsoft knew what it was doing then later backpedaled once he realized how backwards it was. Maybe he assumed that the bugs would have been ironed out by release.

Yeah, I think that a lot of people underestimated the degree of bull-headed "see no evil, hear no evil" incompetence that a certain newly-styled "devices and services" company has displayed with respect to Windows 8. More and more in the tech press seem to be coming around. Read (or listen to) this exchange between host Leo Laporte (founder of This Week in Tech) and security specialist Steve Gibson in a recent "Security Now!" podcast. It starts at about 44:15:

SG: So, for people who care -- and our listeners know how I feel about Windows 8 -- the Windows 8 Pro special $40 upgrade offer ends on February 1, and then it goes up to $199. So --

LL: I bet it doesn't. <laughter> My prediction! Just gonna make a prediction.

SG: Well, OK, it is -- at the Windows blog, there's the link there --

LL: No, they say it ends, I'm just saying, let's see what happens then. 'cause nobody's buying this piece of crap. <laughter>

...

LL: Nobody's buying Windows 8 and making it $200 is not gonna help it sell any better.

...

LL: You know, the more I use it -- I've been reviewing Windows 8 laptops -- the more I use it, the more I wonder what the hell they were thinking.

SG: I know.

LL: It is awful!

The specific prediction didn't come true, but Leo's larger point about Win8 sales is still bearing out.

--JorgeA

#2148
SIW2

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The specific prediction didn't come true, but Leo's larger point about Win8 sales is still bearing out

.

Actually , the prediction was right.

There are plenty of copies of 8 at the promo price or less still available - even now - on Amazon UK and elsewhere. Clearly they still can't shift it even at that price.

Windows 8 Pro, Upgrade Edition [Upgrade from Windows XP, Windows Vista, Windows 7] (PC): Amazon.co.uk: Software

Now MS UK has dropped their Pro price back to the promo price again.To be fair - it is just above the promo price ( 4.99 more including media ). I expect that is because they do not want to undercut the poor retailers who are stiil trying to shift the inventory they already bought .

Windows 8 Pro price slashed to £45 | News | PC Pro




In fairness to Walt, he gave a straight review upon release:

Walt Mossberg Reviews Windows 8

I think he initially advocated on the assumption that Microsoft knew what it was doing then later backpedaled once he realized how backwards it was. Maybe he assumed that the bugs would have been ironed out by release.

Yeah, I think that a lot of people underestimated the degree of bull-headed "see no evil, hear no evil" incompetence that a certain newly-styled "devices and services" company has displayed with respect to Windows 8. More and more in the tech press seem to be coming around. Read (or listen to) this exchange between host Leo Laporte (founder of This Week in Tech) and security specialist Steve Gibson in a recent "Security Now!" podcast. It starts at about 44:15:

SG: So, for people who care -- and our listeners know how I feel about Windows 8 -- the Windows 8 Pro special $40 upgrade offer ends on February 1, and then it goes up to $199. So --

LL: I bet it doesn't. <laughter> My prediction! Just gonna make a prediction.

SG: Well, OK, it is -- at the Windows blog, there's the link there --

LL: No, they say it ends, I'm just saying, let's see what happens then. 'cause nobody's buying this piece of crap. <laughter>

...

LL: Nobody's buying Windows 8 and making it $200 is not gonna help it sell any better.

...

LL: You know, the more I use it -- I've been reviewing Windows 8 laptops -- the more I use it, the more I wonder what the hell they were thinking.

SG: I know.

LL: It is awful!

The specific prediction didn't come true, but Leo's larger point about Win8 sales is still bearing out.

--JorgeA


Edited by SIW2, 04 March 2013 - 11:04 PM.


#2149
HalloweenDocument12

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Leo wasn't on board from the start. He reviewed 8 a few days after the BUILD Conference preview release, was immediately skeptical, and said all the stuff "we" were saying since then as well:

Leo Laporte - The Tech Guy 806

Another thing he was wrong about was at 7:23 where he says that Microsoft will just have to provide a "great big button" to turn off Metro and turn on the Windows 7 interface. Like most of us, he just couldn't believe Microsoft would foist something like this on its customer base.

His dress style hasn't changed one bit in over 15 years. In fact, I think that's actually the exact same shirt.

EDIT: pay attention to him playing chess. He clearly clicks on one pawn only to have the one next to it move.

Edited by HalloweenDocument12, 04 March 2013 - 11:07 PM.


#2150
JorgeA

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The specific prediction didn't come true, but Leo's larger point about Win8 sales is still bearing out

.

Actually , the prediction was right.

There are plenty of copies of 8 at the promo price or less still available - even now - on Amazon UK and elsewhere. Clearly they still can't shift it even at that price.

Windows 8 Pro, Upgrade Edition [Upgrade from Windows XP, Windows Vista, Windows 7] (PC): Amazon.co.uk: Software

Now MS UK has dropped their Pro price back to the promo price again.To be fair - it is just above the promo price ( 4.99 more including media ). I expect that is because they do not want to undercut the poor retailers who are stiil trying to shift the inventory they already bought .

Windows 8 Pro price slashed to £45 | News | PC Pro

Wow, that's remarkable. Just waiting for the tech press on this side of the pond to pick up on what's going on with Win8 sales in the UK.

--JorgeA




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