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Barracuda LP (no, not a 7200.11, nor a 7200.12)

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#1
Eurgene

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Hi folks,

I suppose I can ask this two question in this topic at least because it is about the method of Unlocking terminal of Seagate, the matter in question here.

There are quite a lot data about Seagate Barracuda 7200.11, some - about ES.2 locked terminals but nothing about procedure of Seagate Barracuda ST31500541AS' terminal unlocking. I am desperate to find any information about unlock pins for my 1,5 TB Seagate ST31500541AS (there are valuable family memories over there :( ).

Hence the question: How do you think universal could be this approach with "disconnected" (by unscrewing) head connector instead of short cutting (if we don't know where the unlock pins are)?
And one question more: is it harmless to Seagate Barracuda HDD (regardless of model) to undergo this procedure? To what extent this multiply asynchronous disconnections-connections of multiply connectors safe to HDD and data on it?


Many thanks in advance!

Evgeny.

UPD: Initially HDD was referred as ST31500341AS mistakenly. Correct name is ST31500541AS (pls see picture in the post below).

Edited by Eurgene, 12 July 2012 - 05:13 AM.



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#2
jaclaz

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There are several things that come into play.
First thing is that you may NOT need to short anything (have you tried with the "plain" disconnecting?)
Second is that we don't know if that specifcic model will "unbrick" with the known set of commands.
Third we dont' know WHY exactly your disk is bricked.

ST31500341AS means "very little".

Post two CLEAR photos of the PCB of your disk (BOTH sides of it) and maybe someone may be able to tell you which pins you can try shorting (read channel).

jaclaz

#3
Eurgene

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Thank you jaclaz for the quick response,


There are several things that come into play.
First thing is that you may NOT need to short anything (have you tried with the "plain" disconnecting?)

I am not sure what do you mean as "plain" disconnecting. Could you please explain that?

ST31500341AS means "very little". Post two CLEAR photos of the PCB of your disk (BOTH sides of it) and maybe someone may be able to tell you which pins you can try shorting (read channel).


Done! I added photo of the back side of the PCB as well (maybe it could be useful).

Evgeny.

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#4
jaclaz

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I am not sure what do you mean as "plain" disconnecting. Could you please explain that?

The "traditional" unbricking works normally by EITHER:
  • detach the PCB from the hard disk and re-connect it while powered, after some initial commands <- the original method, now superseded for the 7200.11 by one of the following ones
  • insulate only the Motor contacts with a slip of paper and remove it when powered, after some initial commands <- on some disks this works, on other you need the following
  • insulate only the Head contacts with a slip of paper and remove it when powered, after some initial commands <- on some disks this works, on other you need the previous
The issue at hand is that some models or only some units will produce a LED:000000CC message that prevents sending further commands.
To stop the message above and have enough time to issue the commands the shorting of two pins may work.
It is only logical to try FIRST if you get to the LED:000000CC state BEFORE attempting to short the two pins.

Done! I added photo of the back side of the PCB as well (maybe it could be useful).

I would guess that that would count as the "BOTH" in my request ;).


Your board is a 100535537 REV. A.

From the little I know then your drive is NOT a 7200.11, but a 7200.12 :ph34r: .

From the little info we know:
http://computerscien...ware-fault.html
http://www.facebook....152456431478526
http://www.msfn.org/...ate-720012-fix/
http://www.msfn.org/.../page__st__3894
there is no need to short pins on this.

jaclaz

#5
BlouBul

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From the little I know then your drive is NOT a 7200.11, but a 7200.12 :ph34r: .


From the little I knowPosted ImagePosted Image, it is a 5900 Rpm drive http://www.seagate.c...arracuda_lp.pdf


See if anything here helps:


http://www.msfn.org/...post__p__990707
Jack of all trades, master of none, though ofttimes better than master of one.

#6
jaclaz

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Would you agree on a 7200.12 LP? :unsure: :whistle:

You know, like ;):
http://www.hdd-parts...uda-720012.html
http://www.hdd-parts.com/10113001.html

@Eurgene
Check this also:
http://www.microsoft....ua/7200-12.htm

jaclaz

Edited by jaclaz, 11 July 2012 - 06:02 AM.


#7
BlouBul

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Would you agree on a 7200.12 LP? :unsure: :whistle:


You know, like ;):
http://www.hdd-parts...uda-720012.html
http://www.hdd-parts.com/10113001.html

I am not convinced Posted Image

Maybe some 3rd party part suppliersPosted Image market their PC boards as "Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 ST31500541AS", but it is stated very clearly (from your last link for one)

@Eurgene
Check this also:
http://www.microsoft....ua/7200-12.htm



Earlier this year, Seagate introduced two new series of desktop computing-a logical continuation of the rulers in the form of the Barracuda 7200.12 series and completely new Barracuda LP. If the first more or less clearly, the Barracuda LP-a kind of "child of marketing", which is a hard drive with reduced spindle speed and power consumption.


So AFAICU, the two are mutually exclusive. The 7200.12 spins at 7200 RPM, while the LP spins at the reduced spindle speed of 5900 RPM.Posted Image
Jack of all trades, master of none, though ofttimes better than master of one.

#8
jaclaz

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Well, as i see it, the LP should be part of the 7200.12 family, but of course there are NO certainties, the usage of "child" for the LP actually reinforces my impression of it belonging to the 7200.12 family..... ;)

The good guys at Seagate have of course far too few neurons connected :realmad: to actually provide a senceful naming scheme, so it could be *anything*, the model "ST31500541AS" corresponds also to a "normal" 7200.11 7200 rpm disk, so you may be perfectly right, and the LP couls be any of (PSEUDO-NUMBERS):
  • 7200.11.1
  • 7200.12.1
  • 7200.13
  • 8745.42sx Mark III :w00t:

jaclaz

#9
BlouBul

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Well, as i see it, the LP should be part of the 7200.12 family, but of course there are NO certainties, the usage of "child" for the LP actually reinforces my impression of it belonging to the 7200.12 family..... ;)


Ok, maybe I'll settle for the long lost (adopted?) child of the 7200.12 series, totally confused Posted Image (he hasn't been told of his recently discovered heritage and therefore the identity crisis) and thus still happily spinning at 5900 RPM, but still giving the impression (only due to the long lost family ties discovered and published by the marketing people) of belonging to the 7200.12 familyPosted Image


But I still think Eurgene should rather try the fix for the LP series...Posted Image

the model "ST31500541AS" corresponds also to a "normal" 7200.11 7200 rpm disk

???

Edited by BlouBul, 11 July 2012 - 11:33 AM.

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#10
jaclaz

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But I still think Eurgene should rather try the fix for the LP series...Posted Image

Sure :), no doubt about this, BUT BEFORE that he should see if it actually gets the LED:000000CC state (or *whatever* error) BEFORE attempting to short the two pins, THEN he must know WHICH pins to short, the picture in the thread you referenced is about a board 100617465 REV A, and NOT about the one he has (which is a 100535537 REV A), so we are back to square #1 :ph34r: .

I may produce which pins are to be shorted (if needed) on the 100535537 REV A Board, but if I were Eurgene I wouldn't do anything so d@mn dangerous without further data:
Here:
http://forum.hddguru...ort-t23079.html



the model "ST31500541AS" corresponds also to a "normal" 7200.11 7200 rpm disk

???

It was a retaliation :w00t: against Eurgene's original post.

What was posted:

There are quite a lot data about Seagate Barracuda 7200.11, some - about ES.2 locked terminals but nothing about procedure of Seagate Barracuda ST31500341AS' terminal unlocking. I am desperate to find any information about unlock pins for my 1,5 TB Seagate ST31500341AS (there are valuable family memories over there :( ).




ST31500341AS
http://www.newegg.co...N82E16822148337

What it is really:
ST31500541AS
http://www.newegg.co...N82E16822148412

Comparison:
ST31500341AS
ST31500541AS


jaclaz

Edited by jaclaz, 11 July 2012 - 11:50 AM.


#11
BlouBul

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http://forum.hddguru...ort-t23079.html

Good find Posted ImagePosted ImagePosted Image (guess that is why your title is The Finder)

It was a retaliation :w00t: against Eurgene's original post.

That also got me confused originally...Posted Image
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#12
jaclaz

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Good find Posted ImagePosted ImagePosted Image (guess that is why your title is The Finder)

Yep :), I earned it, rest assured ;):
http://reboot.pro/2764/#entry18795
http://reboot.pro/3078/#entry20899
http://reboot.pro/3096/
http://reboot.pro/8710/#entry74627
http://reboot.pro/8840/#entry76073
http://reboot.pro/12527/#entry109689

Now, back to topic, let's see if we can find a compromise, let's call the stupid thingy a

"Barracuda LP" (no, not a 7200.11, and not a 7200.12)

So that I may be able to ask a Mod/Admin to split this thread from post #36 onwards to a new thread aptly titled ..... :unsure:

jaclaz

#13
Eurgene

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Now, back to topic, let's see if we can find a compromise, let's call the stupid thingy a
"Barracuda LP" (no, not a 7200.11, and not a 7200.12)


Yes, it is "Barracuda LP" and ST31500541AS as follow from the post #38 (picture below is copied from that post) Posted Image

Posted Image


Sorry, my bad Posted Image. I had read about 7200.11 fault too much and wrong number seems stuck in my brain Posted Image.
On the other hand it is obviously that ST31500341AS - is merely 7200.11 (Barracuda 7200.11 Product Overview -Official web-site) but definitely not 7200.12 (Barracuda 7200.12 Product Overview). 1.5 TB Barracuda is ST31500541AS is undoubtedly (Barracuda LP Product Overview - Official Seagate web-site). Anyway, it was my missprint and I ask to accept my apology Posted Image. Post # 36 edited by me.

Thanks alot jaclaz! http://forum.hddguru...ort-t23079.html is a really nice shot and you entirely deserved your title Posted Image.
I have couple thoughts about this solution ('ll be posted in minutes). And - thank you again.

#14
Eurgene

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The "traditional" unbricking works normally by EITHER:
...

Thank you for the axplanation. It means I unerstood you correctly.


The issue at hand is that some models or only some units will produce a LED:000000CC message that prevents sending further commands. To stop the message above and have enough time to issue the commands the shorting of two pins may work

As I have known from the various Internet boards, the 1.5 TB Barracuda is ST31500541AS is just this case. Kind of:

Insulating the contacts to either the motor or the heads (or both) doesn't help in this regard, because Seagate, as it seems, has crippled the electronics on these new drives by making the monitor (and presumably everything else) dependent on something that first has to be read from the platters. In other words, while older disks would communicate on the serial monitor even with the PCB totally disconnected from the motor and the heads, these new drives don't even start to log anything into the monitor until after they've spinned up and read a couple sectors from the platters.

That's why I asked about unlock pins for my 1,5 TB Seagate Barracuda LP.

Anyway. Now it is the time to solder the circuit for connecting to the HDD's monitor. Question is: why do you think on http://forum.hddguru...ort-t23079.html they marked pins to short - on the reverse side if the PCB (despite they had front side photo)? It's strange - if they made shorting on mounted PCB they would remember points on the front side? What for they bring themself to imagine where corresponding contacts are on the opposite side (and probably commit the error) and then forced us to do the reverce procedure?

Another one. I wouldn't like to lose the recorded data therefore payd attention to the post # 20/10/2011 - 14:56 here: Seagate ST31500541AS not communicate through the terminal (translation from Russian): "On the (Barracuda) LP is very likely that the compiler will not identical with the factory one after the conversion. Due to post-process, when defects are introduced directly into the compiler, rather than lists of defects. And most of the information (recorded on HDD) will not be available (for recovery). It is necessary to back "sluzhebku" (technical data, overhead information?) up to not Eat your heart out after then."
Question is: how to back up mentioned above technical data (overhead information?) in orger to restore them if unlock procedure will be destructive to them?

Evgeny.

#15
jaclaz

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Anyway. Now it is the time to solder the circuit for connecting to the HDD's monitor. Question is: why do you think on http://forum.hddguru...ort-t23079.html they marked pins to short - on the reverse side if the PCB (despite they had front side photo)? It's strange - if they made shorting on mounted PCB they would remember points on the front side? What for they bring themself to imagine where corresponding contacts are on the opposite side (and probably commit the error) and then forced us to do the reverce procedure?

Let's see if the attached images help you (and BTW is a good example how the information is - even when disclosed - actually "retained").

First one is a crop of the image you posted ("under" side) of the PCB.

Can you see the contacts "circled" in yellow?
They are the "head" contacts, four sets of five contacts.
Can you see the two contacts circled in red, they are the read channel. (this should be "common" to "all", the .11 and .12, ES2 and LP)
Since you have to short it, the first occurrence that you can do it "from the upper side" is circled in green.
As you may have noticed, most (BTW nice :thumbup ) posts indicating where to short only give you the "upper side" of the specific PCB, so you cannot get a "general rule", the given post is an exception, in the sense that they give you the "under side" position (but you have to find yourself what the points are on the "upper side").

The second image attached (also a crop, this time from your second posted image) circles in green/yellow the (hopefully) same two points, but do check them with a multimeter :ph34r: .



Another one. I wouldn't like to lose the recorded data therefore payd attention to the post # 20/10/2011 - 14:56 here: Seagate ST31500541AS not communicate through the terminal (translation from Russian): "On the (Barracuda) LP is very likely that the compiler will not identical with the factory one after the conversion. Due to post-process, when defects are introduced directly into the compiler, rather than lists of defects. And most of the information (recorded on HDD) will not be available (for recovery). It is necessary to back "sluzhebku" (technical data, overhead information?) up to not Eat your heart out after then."
Question is: how to back up mentioned above technical data (overhead information?) in orger to restore them if unlock procedure will be destructive to them?

Nothing you can do (AFAIK) at home, without some dedicated hardware/software (please read as PC-3000 UDMA), mind you I presume that it could be done at home also through far more econoomical means BUT you would need a number of informations and an amount of training that are far beyond your capabilities/knowledge (NO offence intended ;) ) but worst than that far beyond my capabilities/knowledge (and I would guess beyond those of any non-professional).
More or less all the info we "amateurs" get are the crumbs :w00t: that the guys at hddguru and on a selected number of places, mostly Polish, Russian of Chinese (and thus with the aggraviation of google translate or similar) leave behind them or simply feel - from time to time - exceptionally "good" and give as "charity" to the poors.

The usual caveat applies, it all depends on HOW MUCH you value your data (and are prepared to spend for them) and/or HOW MUCH you like gambling.
Only you can decide if it is the case of forgetting a DIY attempt and pay a pro or risk on an all or nothing bet :whistle: .

jaclaz

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#16
Eurgene

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Nice lesson jaclaz! Havn't anyone told you that you are a born teacher? :) This post is a priceless guidance to those DIY men who want to get few (appetizing) "crumbs" more.

What about professional data recovery - yes, I understand entirely that professional data recovery is preferable. But...

1. I can't afford to pay requested sum. I am not in hurry though and if I find not expensive and reliable service I will take an advantage of it.
2. To tell the truth I am not entirely trust in the professionalism of local IT (sometimes "professionals" can do less then amateurs - as here - died peacefully ST31500541AS ... and also quietly came alive! ). To send the HDD somewhere means to undergo it an extra risc (to be lost, broken up etc.)
3. As we can see (by way of example of 7200.11, 7200.12, ES.2 ...) information from "bricked" Seagates can be successfully recovered. Yes, Seagate did all to prevent that Posted Image in Seagate LP ;) but it still worth to try.

I might probably have DIY as my last resort. What I can do is double-check each step to reduce (sure, not avoid) the risc before I'll start reanimate it.

I did not find my old Siemens data-cable (I did reprogramed DVD players in old good times with it) so tomorrow I'll order Max232 RS232 COM converter on ebay. Meanwile, I am trying to guess a riddle of "m0,2,2,,,,,22 m,6,2,,,,,22" (by the way, don't you know what all this everlasting commas mean? what to input between commas?). I will also try to get authors of posts on http://forum.hddguru...ort-t23079.html to know how successful they were (we do not know if that story had the happy end, do we?)

#17
jaclaz

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I did not find my old Siemens data-cable (I did reprogramed DVD players in old good times with it) so tomorrow I'll order Max232 RS232 COM converter on ebay.

...and thus you will most probably get a "wrong" converter, working at 5V TTL and NOT at 3.3V TTL , I see how the read-me-first:
http://www.msfn.org/...-read-me-first/
besides NEVER being read FIRST :w00t: , is NOT actually read at all! :realmad: .
Commas are parameter separators, two consequently commas simply mean that the parameter between them is omitted.
DO NOT EVEN THINK of experimenting with seagate terminal commands. :ph34r:
Your ONLY choice is to find a set of commands and issue them EXACTLY, even a very minor change may make your driive not only "bricked" but also IRRECOVERABLE.
DO NOT try inventing a new set of commands.

There is a "manual" for Seagate commands linked to in the "main" thread, though, here:
http://www.msfn.org/...ds/page__st__15
AND read these:
http://forum.hddguru...s-t6411-40.html
http://forum.hddguru...nds-t11926.html

jaclaz




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