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Win98 from CD loads config from HD installed Windows

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35 replies to this topic

#1
Telop

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I need some help.
I 've prepared Windows 98 SE bootable CD from different methods, including WinBuilder, Hiren's method and no-emulation way and fdd emulation way.
BUT in all I got the same problem. All iso works perfectly in VM (I use Virtual Box). But whenever I burnt the iso on CD and boot the PC with that, Windows 98 always loads its settings/configuration from my already installed Windows98 on C Partition.
For, example it tells that LMOUHID.VXD is in your system.ini and bla bla and then it shuts down.
It demands all those drivers which are specifically included in the C:\Windows\System.ini or the registry of HD-installed Windows.
I have tried all tries known to me, including, Path in MSDOS.SYS, set path, even I hex-edited all the files on the Boot-CD to change C:\ to X:\.
Alas, it always loads its system.ini from C.
What to do? I think this is the main hurdle. On systems with no OS installed, it runs OK. but for the maintenance and repair purpose, I was never able to run a windows98 bootable CD because of the above-mentioned facts.
I also see that nearly all the screen-shots posted by the author or testers, are taken when they ran it in a vm.


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#2
Kelsenellenelvian

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We cannot help you with anything hirens related as it is illegal and considered warez.

 

See forum rules especially #1

 

http://www.msfn.org/...ated-must-read/

 

» No Illegal/Copyrighted Software Discussion

1.a This is not a warez site! Links/Requests to warez and/or illegal material (e.g., cracks, serials, etc.) will not be tolerated. Discussion of circumventing WGA/activation/timebombs/license restrictions, use of keygens, or any other illegal activity, including, but not limited to, requests for help where pirated software is being used or being discussed, will also not be tolerated. Offenders may be banned on first violation.



#3
Telop

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We cannot help you with anything hirens related as it is illegal and considered warez.

hey, you totally misunderstood my question.
I've read the msfn rules and i know that this site, and me too, donot support any kind of illegal activity.
I DID NOT ASK ABOUT ANYTHING ABOUT HIREN BOOT CD
All I asked that I have used various methods, in my home, using my legitimate old windows 98 SE CD, to make a bootable Windows 98 Live CD. I also mentioned that I used all available method's of CREATING A BOOTABLE WIN98 CD. I did not ask about any help how to use / burn / make the Hiren CD.
Lol you were in a hurry so don't rush at me now.
All I ask to get some info / help on the issue i am facing.
OK, I rephrase my question.

I am trying and testing Winbuilder's Windows 98 Live CD project. I also used other methods of creating BOOTABLE CD, using syslinux, grub and etc. The issue is that all works OK in VM, but when I boot the CD, Windows 98 always tries to load system.ini and registry from my ALREADY-INSTALLED Windows 98 on Hard disk's C partition.
This is the issue.

1.a This is not a warez site! Links/Requests to warez and/or illegal material (e.g., cracks, serials, etc.) will not be tolerated.

Just read my post again, who is requesting for illegal material? All I ask is the issue mentioned above. I dont like Hiren CD, and I want to make my own legitimized Windows 98 CD with my own Original Windows 98 SE legitimized CD.
If you now understand what I am asking , please help, otherwise dont accuse me for things I never did.
wishes

#4
jaclaz

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See if you can use Letter Assigner to give the "resident" Windows 98 install volume a different drive letter from C:\ :unsure::

http://www.msfn.org/...e-4#entry971912

 

But it seems to me that there is *something* "wrong" in the way you build your "bootable Windows 98 CD", at the time there were not such issues that I can remember and I doubt :w00t: - no offence intended :) - that you managed to build a working 98 from the latest Winbuilder project, as that is seemingly "botched" :unsure::

The original thread on MSFN:

http://www.msfn.org/...project-update/

 

Latest version is here (but it has seemingly "issues")

http://reboot.pro/to...-on-windows-98/

 

(you'll need some patience to load pages on reboot.pro, since it is a bit hectic, currently).

 

Besides the "casual" reference to WAREZ, you do not provide enough details on the methods you attempted using, if you need help in troubleshooting you will need to better detail what you did, we do need the "standard litany":

http://homepage.ntlw...ard-litany.html

 

Please consider how summing up in writing the sequence of actions you performed up to smallest detail often helps in making clear to you which steps/actions may be involved in the issue and/or highlight those that you did slightly differently from the guide(s) you were following and/or draw you attention to those steps that you performed just following the guide(s) but that you didn't fully understand the reason for.

 

jaclaz



#5
Telop

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Hello and thanks jaclaz,
first i need to say THANKS YOU, I have read a numbers of your informative posts and am impressed with your knowledge.

I admit I am not a man of pen as I still on my way of learning english language, and could not put my question in proper words and details, so here I try to put some details.

I also say sorry to Kelsenellenelvian that my dipersed words made him not to understand my question and I also sorry to use the word "HI**N". I am not a programmer nor an IT specialist, but simply a hobbyist. Hit-n-try is my first and last resort. I made many bootable cds ,mainly DOS-Tool CD, multi-iso-boot DC's using ISOLINUX and BCDWizard etc. Recently I tried Bart PE and Win builder with success only for WinXP. Win98 failed me.

WinBuilder Details:
-------------------
- WinBuilder Version: 77.101.0.0 (77.101) (obtained by right clicking > properties > version)

Windows 98 SE Live Project details:
-----------------------------------
- downloaded from: http://reboot.pro/to...-on-windows-98/
- Posted by BeatZero

My Working Environment:
-----------------------
Active system: Windows XP Professional SP2 (i.e., I run WinBuidler Projest on it).
System: Multi-boot: 1- Windows 98 SE on C (1st partition of 1st HDD).
(Memory capped to 1GB - Kernelx installed)
2- Windows XP Professional SP2 on D (1st partition od 2nd HDD).
3- Windows XP Professional for Gaming on F (3rd partition od 1st HDD).


Project Details:
----------------
Downloaded, extracted, I did not do any changes to the project setting except to set path to w98 CD as source.
Started winbuilder, just looked at each tree, and started the project. The ISO created, tested in VirtualBox, it
ran smoothly with no error.

Burnt the ISO on a CD-RW, rebooted, system booted, saw Windows 98 SE logo, the files extracting from Y (CD Drive) to the RamDrive (X), then it asked things like that:

windows could not find the device driver xxxxx.vxd referenced in system.ini or registry (bla bla), if you deleted the file bla bla...

when I pressed any key, Windows complaints for another driver, and third time it asked for LMOUHID.VXD, this time windows does not like pressing any key and shut downs.
When I analyzed the files, ini's and the registry , this LMOUHID.VXD file is not present there, nor it is referenced in registry or system.ini, it is specifically present on my C partition already installed Windows 98 and it is for my Logitech mouse from setpoint.

I again started analyzing the files in ISO...for all paths references, eg,
checked these files for any reference to C Partition: MSDOS.SYS, AUTOEXEC.BAT, CONFIG.SYS, SYSTEM.INI, WIN.INI
Nothing found wrong. Then I deleted the line in autoexec.bat which invokes a copy command for a file "START.BAT" because this files was not found in the iso, rebuild the iso, reboot, problem remains the same.
Then I thought that since GRLDR is used for this no-emulation CD and the boot.ima is hooke and maped in memory, so I thought may be this is the cause, as in my past experience, booting via syslinux or GNU Grub, loads from hd instead of CD (later i found i was wrong caz using wrong things in menu.lst), so I planned to make a floppy-emulation bootable CD, that i am used to make for more than 5 years.
so I created bootable CD with a working 2.88 mb floppy image, edited config.sys for a menu entry for Windows98 and autoexec for its label and added all commands from the iso's autoexec.bat under this label. The reult was same, win98 booted but started asking for device drivers which are on C:\ windows, then shuts down.

I hope I might have written all details, but as I said I am not a man of pen, so there might be some things missing, please ask whatever you want I will try to answer in detail.
Noe from your kind reply, what I understand is that:
- The latest Winbuilder project is botched (I used a dictionary to get the meaning of "botched").
- Original thread site is: http://www.msfn.org/...project-update/
- Latest version of it is at: http://reboot.pro/to...-on-windows-98/

Yes you are right , I downloaded it from the latest project site that is "botched".
So now I am going to download all from the original thread, and will post the results here.

I really thank you guys from replying my and showing will to help me, and I apologized for any casual use of "WAREZ". Truly speaking I did not know that giving ref to HI**N is warez activity.

I dont like ready-made boot-able Cd's so using HI**N is out of question, I like to create my own because it is my hobby to play with computer. I studied HI**N cd only to understand the method that was used to make it bootable, besides, I have a number of botable CD's ISO just to understand the mechanism, again i need to state that these I So's are mainly from antivirus software vendors like kaspersky rescue, F-Prot etc or from freeware software like memtest+ ISO, etc.
-



#6
Telop

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I will change my avatar ASAP because it looks like WAREZ omg

#7
jaclaz

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Yes, the original project worked (at the time).

BeatZero cites WInbuilder version 075.Beta 5j (but possibly that is in order to run the project from within Windows 98). :unsure:

 

The *new* version of the project, starting from here:

http://reboot.pro/to...ws-98/?p=130343

has been reported as having some issues.

The OP abandoned the game early, but I  remember that - compared to the "original" project that was extremely simple - I noticed at the time an overaly of complexity (unneeded) in the new version.

Re-reading that thread, it seems to me how half if not all the issues were with drive lettering of the one or other kind.

 

The "old" project is NOT online anymore, but you may be able to get it through the wayback machine:

http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://win98livecd.winbuilder.net/*

If you cannot, just say so, and I'll see if I can find a copy of it and re-post it *somewhere*.

 

jaclaz



#8
rloew

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Try replacing the MSDOS.SYS file in the Boot portion of the CD image with a File containing just a Semicolon and a CRLF.
Ye who enter my domain. Beware! Lest you become educated in the mysteries of the universe and suffer forever from the desire to know more.

#9
TmEE

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SETUP /nr


Posted Image Mida sa loed ? Nagunii aru ei saa ;)

#10
jaclaz

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SETUP /nr

Are you sure that setup is involved in any way in the project? :unsure:

 

jaclaz



#11
StartButton

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But it seems to me that there is *something* "wrong" in the way you build your "bootable Windows 98 CD", at the time there were not such issues that I can remember and I doubt  :w00t: - no offence intended :) - that you managed to build a working 98 from the latest Winbuilder project, as that is seemingly "botched" :unsure::

The original thread on MSFN:

http://www.msfn.org/...project-update/

 

Latest version is here (but it has seemingly "issues")

http://reboot.pro/to...-on-windows-98/

 

Yes it is botched. The latest Winbuilder project (August 2011) couldn't even complete the build on W98. It had the following problems:

 

1) Changing the screen resolution preference in the GUI causes the 01-WIN98_BASE.script to become truncated to 64kb, resulting in build failure. The way around this is to change the resolution preference manually in a text editor such as PSPad. A longer term solution would be to put the preferences and GUI into a sepereate smaller script less then 64kb, so truncation won't be a problem.

 

2) Build failure occurs when the script fails to find explorer.exe in the Win98LiveCD\APP_TMP\Win95Shell\ folder. The solution is to add the following lines to 01-WIN98_BASE.script at the point directly above where it looks for explorer.exe

ShellExecute,Hide,"%Tools%\7za.exe","x #$q%SourceDir%\win98\WIN98_22.CAB#$q explorer.exe -y -o#$q%BaseDir%\Temp\Win98LiveCD\APP_TMP\Win95Shell\#$q"
ShellExecute,Hide,"%Tools%\7za.exe","x #$q%SourceDir%\win98\WIN98_22.CAB#$q shell32.dll -y -o#$q%BaseDir%\Temp\Win98LiveCD\APP_TMP\Win95Shell\#$q"

3) The 01-Finalize Image.Script stage maxes out the computers ram because the script uses default 7zip compression settings and 7zip is appalling with ram usage. The solution is to change the 7zip compression settings to lower compression level in 01-Finalize Image.Script by adding -mx1 parameter. (The resulting windows.7z file will now be 10mb instead of 9mb, but will compress in ~10seconds rather than 1hr.)

ShellExecute,Hide,"%Tools%\7za.exe","a #$q%WIN98%\Windows.7z#$q -y -mx1 #$q%targetDir%\WINDOWS\#$q"
ShellExecute,Hide,"%Tools%\7za.exe","a #$q%WIN98%\Windows.7z#$q -y -mx1 #$q%TargetDir%\*.*#$q"
ShellExecute,Hide,"%Tools%\7za.exe","a #$q%WIN98%\Windows.7z#$q -y -mx1 #$q%TargetDir%\Programas\#$q"

 4) mkisofs hangs at the stage where the iso is to be made because the version of mkisofs supplied with the project is not compatible with Windows 98. The solution is to replace the mkisofs with another version supplied on a 2008 edition of UltimateBootCD.

 

Making the above modifications will cause the most recent Winbuilder project to successfully build on Windows 98. However on booting from the CD, it suffers from the same problem Telop decribed. It starts loading windows from the installed hard drive instead of the CD and complains about missing DLLs and gets stuck in a loop on the choose screen display resolution dialog.

 

I tried an earlier WinBuilder project dated Feb 2010 off archive.org however, build failure occured on this project too, complaining that explorer.exe not found, as described in #2 above.

 

Which is the last version of Win98 live boot CD that actually works?


Edited by StartButton, 12 February 2014 - 02:40 PM.


#12
jaclaz

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Which is the last version of Win98 live boot CD that actually works?

 

Cannot really say.

I followed (and helped a bit in the making) if the early versions, until BeatZero was able to "fly on it's own".

http://www.msfn.org/...project-update/

But seemingly later he made some extra-complex (and seemingly completely unlike *needed* :ph34r:) modifications to the project that made it not working (and unfortunately "vanished" from the scene :().

 

 

This should be the last version that I actually tested and built successfully:

http://reboot.pro/to...ws-98/?p=130617

 

If you want to have a go at it, I can upload it somewhere and provide you a link to it.

 

On the already mentioned thread:

http://reboot.pro/to...-on-windows-98/

a couple of user started troubleshooting the issues but left the game too early :w00t:

 

JFYI, very recently another user on reboot.pro is trying to find a way to have it working (with scarce results, I am afraid):

http://reboot.pro/to...ub4dosfrom-usb/

 

Still, the issue with conflicts with an existing Windows 98 install is "before and outside" a successful build or not and - as said earlier - as I see it, it can only be resolved by somehow *forcing*  a different drive letter to the hard disk partition hosting the "base" Windows 98:

http://www.msfn.org/...dows/?p=1047330

 

The alternate approach, that noone seemingly in all these years has had the interest (or time, or knowledge :ph34r:) to finalize is to rebuild a 98 CD in either the Winimize way, see:

http://reboot.pro/forum/53-winimize/

or re-creating - without using the original registry redirector - a build like the Qualystem one:

http://www.911cd.net...?showtopic=8607

http://www.911cd.net...showtopic=12326

http://reboot.pro/to...try-redirector/

 

jaclaz



#13
StartButton

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This should be the last version that I actually tested and built successfully:
http://reboot.pro/to...ws-98/?p=130617
 
If you want to have a go at it, I can upload it somewhere and provide you a link to it.
 

Yes please, if you could upload the last working version that would be great! :)

#14
jaclaz

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Yes please, if you could upload the last working version that would be great! :)

 

Here :):

http://www2.zshares.net/jna09jvhxiwl

See what you can get with it, and please report your progresses.

 

jaclaz



#15
StartButton

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See what you can get with it, and please report your progresses. :)

Thanks for the upload. I gave it a go on Win 98Se  with KernelEx and the result is build failure.

 

The project scripts try to shell execute "cmd.exe". There is no such thing as cmd.exe on Windows 98, there is command.exe instead!

 

Also, it tries to use a program called vdk.exe to build a floppy image. VDK.exe says it runs on WinNT only, not on Win98. The virtual drive cannot be created on Win98, meaning when the script tries to copy files into the virtual floppy image, the result is build failure.  

 

The offending lines:

ShellExecute,Hide,"cmd.exe","/c #$q#$q%Tools%\VDK\VDK.EXE#$q OPEN * #$q%Temp%\WIN98\WIN98.IMG#$q /L:%pScrollBox61% /RW#$q#$q"
//ShellExecute,Hide,"imdisk.exe"," -a -f #$q%Temp%\WIN98\WIN98.IMG#$q -m %pScrollBox61%:#$q"
FileCopy,"%Work%\*.*","%pScrollBox61%:\"
FileCopy,"%Work%\DOS\*.*","%pScrollBox61%:\DOS\"
FileCopy,"%Work%\WIN98\*.*","%pScrollBox61%:\WIN98\"
FileCopy,"%Tools%\MENU.LST","%Temp%\"
FileCopy,"%Tools%\GRLDR","%Temp%\"
ShellExecute,Hide,"cmd.exe","/c #$q#$q%Tools%\VDK\VDK.EXE#$q CLOSE * /F#$q#$q"
//ShellExecute,Hide,"imdisk.exe"," -D -m %pScrollBox61%:#$q"

It needs a Win 98 compatible way to build the floppy image.



#16
submix8c

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Guess you must have missed the preceding Post Links? :unsure:

http://www.msfn.org/...project-update/

Requirements:
-Windows 98 Second Edition CDROM
-Computer with Windows XP, 2K3, vista or Win7
-Virtual PC or VMWare for test your ISO (optional)
WinBuilder Projects inevitably require minimum XP. ;)

Someday the tyrants will be unthroned... Jason "Jay" Chasteen; RIP, bro!

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#17
jumper

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> I gave it a go on Win 98Se with KernelEx and the result is build failure.

KernelEx told it you were running it on Windows 2000.

Do one of these:
1) uninstall KernelEx
or
2) In %windir%\KernelEx\CORE.INI, set [ApiConfigurations] default=2

then reboot and try again.
Design feedback requested:
IHAtool - IpHlpApi tester; call various functions and report results
--status-> framework is solid; 22 api's fully supported; preview release coming soon
ComDlg32 wrapper - ComDlgEx meets IpHlpApi wrapper
--status-> PrintDlgExW working in latest SumatraPDF 8^)
Future projects: ImportPatcher40 - dialog interface; Kexter - IP40+Ktree+Kexstubs

#18
StartButton

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Guess you must have missed the preceding Post Links? :unsure:

http://www.msfn.org/...project-update/

 

 

Requirements:
-Windows 98 Second Edition CDROM
-Computer with Windows XP, 2K3, vista or Win7
-Virtual PC or VMWare for test your ISO (optional)
WinBuilder Projects inevitably require minimum XP. ;)

 

 

BeatZero also posted a screenshot of Winbuilder successfully compiling it on Windows 98. Winbuilder does work on Win98, I have successfully built other projects on Win 98.  The problem is not with Winbuilder but with the 3rd party helper tool which builds the 15mb super floppy image vdk.exe.

> I gave it a go on Win 98Se with KernelEx and the result is build failure.

KernelEx told it you were running it on Windows 2000.

Do one of these:
1) uninstall KernelEx
or
2) In %windir%\KernelEx\CORE.INI, set [ApiConfigurations] default=2

then reboot and try again.

Excellent! I was looking for a way to disable KernelEx by default for other purposes.



#19
jumper

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"CORE.INI [ApiConfigurations] default=2" doesn't disable KernelEx, but sets the default to Win98+enhancements.

Set this registry value to disable KernelEx by default on apps not explicitly set to another mode:
Kex+.reg
------------
REGEDIT4

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\KernelEx]
"DisableExtensions"=dword:00000001

And to enable:
Kex-.reg
------------
REGEDIT4

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\KernelEx]
"DisableExtensions"=dword:00000000

Edited by jumper, 14 February 2014 - 04:41 PM.

Design feedback requested:
IHAtool - IpHlpApi tester; call various functions and report results
--status-> framework is solid; 22 api's fully supported; preview release coming soon
ComDlg32 wrapper - ComDlgEx meets IpHlpApi wrapper
--status-> PrintDlgExW working in latest SumatraPDF 8^)
Future projects: ImportPatcher40 - dialog interface; Kexter - IP40+Ktree+Kexstubs

#20
StartButton

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"CORE.INI [ApiConfigurations] default=2" doesn't disable KernelEx, but sets the default to Win98+enhancements.

Set this registry value to disable KernelEx by default on apps not explicitly set to another mode:

Kex+.reg
------------
REGEDIT4

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\KernelEx]
"DisableExtensions"=dword:00000001
And to enable:
Kex-.reg
------------
REGEDIT4

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\KernelEx]
"DisableExtensions"=dword:00000000

Thanks for the info. KernelEx could do with them in 2 reg files included in the install folder so people can change it's default setting nice and easily.



#21
jaclaz

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WinBuilder Projects inevitably require minimum XP. ;)

NO, not really.
The specific project should include an oldish version of Winbuilder that does run under Windows 9x.
http://reboot.pro/to...-on-windows-98/

The point here is that there are at least three versions of the project more likely 4 or 5, one (simple) that worked (and worked from within Win98) a second one (that presumably I posted) which is still "simple enough" and working (but that does not from under 9x/Me) and a third - and a fourth one that were released after Beatzero was affected by "featuritis" and are overcomplex and do not work (not even on XP and similar).
Originally, I suggested him NOT the use of either IMDISK or VDK, but rather that of other tools compatible with Windows 98:

http://www.msfn.org/...pdate/?p=908112

To have it working on Windows 98 one has probably to use the "simpler" approach, but replace the VDK with one of the tools later used or fix the whatever is causing the issue with the build on the later version.

There must be a "working" version (actually two) early 2010, but they are not on the server nor on the Wayback Machine.
It is a MESS. :(
It is well possible that the one I posted is not the "right" one, intially Beatzero used a version number, then suddenly removed it so it is difficult to keep track of the versions.
I have posted a version where filedates inside the 7z are 2009-12-23.
The one at http://win98livecd.w...dir=compressed/ is seemingly dated 2011-08-13 but files inside the archive have date 2010-02-14.
I have a Win98LiveCDBuilder_109.7z with date inside 2010-01-15.

jaclaz

#22
submix8c

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I stand corrected.  :blushing:  It appears that compatible programs will need to be obtained and the scripts modified accordingly. :unsure:


Someday the tyrants will be unthroned... Jason "Jay" Chasteen; RIP, bro!

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#23
StartButton

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I have a Win98LiveCDBuilder_109.7z with date inside 2010-01-15.

 

Sounds like Jan 2010 must be the working version. Can you upload it please?



#24
dencorso

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Donator

 

I have a Win98LiveCDBuilder_109.7z with date inside 2010-01-15.

 
Sounds like Jan 2010 must be the working version. Can you upload it please?

 

 

Is it, perchance, this one?   dubbio.gif



#25
submix8c

submix8c

    Inconceivable!

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re: zshares link

Unable to connect       
          Firefox can't establish a connection to the server at www3.zshare.ma.
  The site could be temporarily unavailable or too busy. Try again in a few
    moments.
  If you are unable to load any pages, check your computer's network
    connection.
  If your computer or network is protected by a firewall or proxy, make sure
    that Firefox is permitted to access the Web.

Dang it! (got the other two linked above - both say v1.06/same date?)

Someday the tyrants will be unthroned... Jason "Jay" Chasteen; RIP, bro!

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