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POSReady 2009 updates ported to Windows XP SP3 ENU

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#176
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I'm guessing here but I don't see why not.  XP is XP is XP. FLP probably has more in common with consumer XP than POS's XP.


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#177
MrMaguire

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Well apparently the modification does work on Windows Fundamentals for Legacy PCs, somebody who I know of tried it with that result. However, I haven't been able to get it to work on my FLP test installation. It is a rather junky installation, so I dunno. I'm guessing that it should work. Actually, I have a suspicion that POS Ready 2009 is based off of FLP.



#178
nostaglic98

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Whilst I am no longer a Windows-XP user, I am interested in this project.

 

Does anyone know if the patches being applied are relevant to the XP Kernel, or if they are patching the "holes" they are supposed to as effectively as in their native OS's?

This question was posed by a "security-conscious" friend of mine, who wondered if this was merely appearing to work, but not actually beneath the skin of it.



#179
MrMaguire

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Whilst I am no longer a Windows-XP user, I am interested in this project.

 

Does anyone know if the patches being applied are relevant to the XP Kernel, or if they are patching the "holes" they are supposed to as effectively as in their native OS's?

This question was posed by a "security-conscious" friend of mine, who wondered if this was merely appearing to work, but not actually beneath the skin of it.

 

Well from what I've seen so far, the KB numbers between the updates issued for Windows Embedded POS Ready 2009 and Windows Server 2003 do match. In fact they even match with the updates issued for Windows Server 2008 and R2 and probably Windows Vista and 7. So I'm guessing that they're all just the same updates, and work just like any previous updates for Windows XP.



#180
nostaglic98

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Whilst I am no longer a Windows-XP user, I am interested in this project.

 

Does anyone know if the patches being applied are relevant to the XP Kernel, or if they are patching the "holes" they are supposed to as effectively as in their native OS's?

This question was posed by a "security-conscious" friend of mine, who wondered if this was merely appearing to work, but not actually beneath the skin of it.

 

Well from what I've seen so far, the KB numbers between the updates issued for Windows Embedded POS Ready 2009 and Windows Server 2003 do match. In fact they even match with the updates issued for Windows Server 2008 and R2 and probably Windows Vista and 7. So I'm guessing that they're all just the same updates, and work just like any previous updates for Windows XP.

 

 

This seems like a reasonable explanation. If POS-Ready is based on XP, then it would be okay.

But Server 2003, whilst based in that code, is an x64 OS, no? So it would be featured up differently.

 

Just checked the Wiki on POS-Ready, and I cannot believe the HUGE jump in installation size from 2009 - 7/8 variants. Thats just an incredible amount of bloat. They're CHECKOUT computers, for goodness sake!



#181
MrMaguire

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Windows Server 2003 and XP come in both 32 bit and 64 bit flavours, there is very little difference feature wise between the two variations. So I imagine that the updates are nearly identical.

 

You may be confusing Windows Embedded POS Ready 2009 with Windows Embedded Standard 2009. POS Ready 2009 has roughly the same footprint as XP, Standard 2009 however is quite a bit larger. Or at least the installation media is.



#182
jaclaz

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You may be confusing Windows Embedded POS Ready 2009 with Windows Embedded Standard 2009. POS Ready 2009 has roughly the same footprint as XP, Standard 2009 however is quite a bit larger. Or at least the installation media is.


They are completely different beasts.
The Windows Embedded Standard is a set of "components" which you can assemble in different ways, so the size of the build may vary from as little as a few Mbytes (a very basic build with Minlogon and CMD.EXE as shell) up to the "full" XP size.
The POSReady2009 can be considered as a particular "build" made out of Windows Embedded that contains ALL the same components as "normal" XP.
 
Just for the record (and not that it makes a lot of sense, mind you) the *theory* was (and is) the following:
"One single OS should Rule 'em all" :w00t: :ph34r:
 
The "normal XP" and it's incredible amount of bloat (when compared to other slimmer previous OS's) should have been "good for anything".
 
This plan did not work, and Windows XP Embedded was born.
XP Embedded is the "right" thing, it is (again in theory) a "componentized" model that allows to build all kinds of very customized environment.
Unfortunately making a build (a working one) is something that populates for weeks the nightmares of those attempting to build one, as the complication and the "interconnectedness of all things" makes creating a working build near to impossible, and as soon as you get one, once you test it you find that something is missing, and you need to start rebuilding it, adding more components, until, little by little you have once again a "full" XP. :(
 
WinFLP had a different approach, it is pre-stripped of a number of components (besides having the at the time experimental "new" deploying approach), within it's limits, it does work, and the removal of components is aimed specifically to running XP on a low powered machine, but, still, it may have issues with third party components and what not. (we are talking 2005 here)
 
This approach (.wim deploying, etc.) made it's way to WePOS, that AFAIK has never had that much success.
 
In the meantime even the stupidest of PoS have become an extremely powerful hardware platform and this prompted for the making of POSReady 2009, the key here is the "Ready" in the name, there is no need to spend weeks or months to make an Embedded build, it is a "plain" XP with "standard" features and capabilities, with a rather restricted licence bolted on and an aggressive licence cost.  
 
To recap (IMHO):
  • Windows XP Embedded (depending on the specific build) can be from (say) 22% to 98% similar to "full" XP
  • WinFLP is (still say) 63% similar to "full" XP
  • WePOS is (still say) 75% similar to "full" XP
  • POSReady2009 is 99.99%  similar to "full" XP <- please read as EXACTLY "full" XP with some very minor changes
jaclaz
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#183
MrMaguire

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Okay, I've just tested the modification to the registry with Windows Fundamentals for Legacy PCs. It does work. But what's interesting about FLP is that it has its own registry flag for Windows Update. And I suspect that it was the first XP based OS that isn't specifically Windows XP to have it.

 

Fundamentals_Installed_Key_FLP.png

 

Notice that I have the POS Ready 2009 flag too. I'm not sure if the two conflict with each other. I have tried to change and remove the Fundamentals key and DWORD value, with no success. I checked the permissions and it looks like Administrators for the local machine do have full control. So, I dunno.

 

____________

 

Also, I had no idea that FLP used a .WIM image for its installer. I wonder if the image can be extracted and added to a Windows Deployment Services server for fresh network installations?

 

POS Ready seems to have a different setup. I did check the installation media and I found a .WIM image called "Setup" being 151MB or so in size. I don't believe that is big enough to contain the whole OS, probably just the actual setup portion. The FLP .WIM image is around 350MB for comparison.



#184
jaclaz

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Yep, but more than that it is (the WinFlp) AND IF I recall correctly :unsure: an "early" version of the .wim format not really compatible with anything else if not (maybe) with some Longhorn releases, JFYI:

http://reboot.pro/to...30-windows-flp/

 

You can always access the Registry Offline (booting from another instance of a NT OS or booting to a PE) to experiment with that key, you can either "import" the hive or use the Offline Registry tool to that effect:

http://reboot.pro/to...fline-registry/

 

jaclaz



#185
MrMaguire

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Does anyone happen to know what happens if the registry modification is applied to Windows XP Professional x64 Edition? I would try it myself, but I have no way of testing 64bit software.



#186
dencorso

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XP Pro x64 is the same codebase as Server 2003... so it's a very different (although not totally different) animal.

Accordingly, my guess is adding the POSReady 2009 spoof to it ought probably totally hose the system.



#187
MrMaguire

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Yeah...  that's kinda why I didn't wanna try it, my only 64bit XP machine is my main computer.



#188
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Adding the registry entries given in the first post doesn't seem to have any effect on a fully updated XP x64 system in VirtualBox when checking the Microsoft Update website. No other testing has been performed with the entries however, so your results may vary, MrMaguire.

Edited by 5eraph, 25 June 2014 - 01:42 AM.


#189
jaclaz

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I don't think they ever made 64 bit POS machines! :w00t: (and thus I believe that POSReady2009 only exists in 32 bit).

 

jaclaz


Edited by jaclaz, 25 June 2014 - 02:33 AM.


#190
Tripredacus

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Adding the registry entries given in the first post doesn't seem to have any effect on a fully updated XP x64 system in VirtualBox when checking the Microsoft Update website. No other testing has been performed with the entries however, so your results may vary, MrMaguire.


My experience with XPx64 is limited, but I wonder if there is a wow6432Node section of the registry like in 7x64 OS? If there is, maybe that registry key would work there. 
 

I don't think they ever made 64 bit POS machines! :w00t: (and thus I believe that POSReady2009 only exists in 32 bit).
 
jaclaz


I do not know about POSReady 2009, but POSReady7 is available in 64bit.
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#191
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I don't think they ever made 64 bit POS machines! :w00t: (and thus I believe that POSReady2009 only exists in 32 bit).
 
jaclaz


I do not know about POSReady 2009, but POSReady7 is available in 64bit.

 

You are right, :yes:.

 

Good to know :) still hopefully the perverted minds at MS did not get affected by the 64 bit illness before 2011. :unsure:

 

jaclaz


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#192
dersonpg

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Okay, I've just tested the modification to the registry with Windows Fundamentals for Legacy PCs. It does work. But what's interesting about FLP is that it has its own registry flag for Windows Update. And I suspect that it was the first XP based OS that isn't specifically Windows XP to have it.

 

Fundamentals_Installed_Key_FLP.png

 

Notice that I have the POS Ready 2009 flag too. I'm not sure if the two conflict with each other. I have tried to change and remove the Fundamentals key and DWORD value, with no success. I checked the permissions and it looks like Administrators for the local machine do have full control. So, I dunno.

 

____________

 

Also, I had no idea that FLP used a .WIM image for its installer. I wonder if the image can be extracted and added to a Windows Deployment Services server for fresh network installations?

 

POS Ready seems to have a different setup. I did check the installation media and I found a .WIM image called "Setup" being 151MB or so in size. I don't believe that is big enough to contain the whole OS, probably just the actual setup portion. The FLP .WIM image is around 350MB for comparison.

 

MrMaguire,

excellent news to hear that the change in the Windows registry worked. I appreciate the info!

Thanks! :w00t:



#193
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My experience with XPx64 is limited, but I wonder if there is a wow6432Node section of the registry like in 7x64 OS? If there is, maybe that registry key would work there.


There is no Wow6432Node registry subkey in the HKLM\SYSTEM key of XP x64 or Win7 x64. ;)

Edited by 5eraph, 25 June 2014 - 04:06 PM.


#194
MrMaguire

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Adding the registry entries given in the first post doesn't seem to have any effect on a fully updated XP x64 system in VirtualBox when checking the Microsoft Update website. No other testing has been performed with the entries however, so your results may vary, MrMaguire.


My experience with XPx64 is limited, but I wonder if there is a wow6432Node section of the registry like in 7x64 OS? If there is, maybe that registry key would work there.

 

This is interesting. I did a search in the registry for "wow6432" and came up with a key in the following locations:

 

HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\Wow6432node

 

HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Classes\Wow6432node

 

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Classes\Wow6432node

 

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432node

 

HKEY_USERS\.DEFAULT\Software\Classes\Wow6432node

 

HKEY_USERS\S-1-5-18\Software\Classes\Wow6432node

 

HKEY_USERS\S-1-5-19\Software\Classes\Wow6432node

 

HKEY_USERS\S-1-5-20\Software\Classes\Wow6432node

 

And a couple of other places that (to me at least) don't really seem relevant.

 

___________

 

But even if we can get Windows XP x64 to spoof as POS Ready 2009 in Windows Update, the likelihood that the updates will install is pretty slim. As a lot of you know, Windows XP 64bit does use a slightly different kernel to the original 32bit version. So, I dunno. Really what we wanna do is try to spoof Windows Server 2003 on XP x64. If there's a way to differentiate between the two in the registry, it might work out just as well.

 

We're just lucky that POS Ready 2009 is as poorly made as it was by the Microsoft engineers. :angel

 

__________

 

I think the way that Microsoft managed to differentiate from Windows XP x64 and Server 2003 on Windows Update and with other software, is through the "Hardware Abstraction Layer" number.

 

Windows XP Professional x64 Edition: Version = "5.2.3790.4354 (srv03_sp2_qfe.080813-1204)"

 

Windows Server 2003 R2 Enterprise Edition x86: Version = "5.2.3790.3959 (srv03_sp2_rtm.070216-1710)"

 

It must be the difference between those two numbers. 4354 and 3959. I'm pretty sure that this applies to Vista and 7 too with their Server counterparts. That is also probably the reason why some updates from XP or Vista such as RDC 7 refuse to install in the Server OS's.



#195
MrMaguire

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Yep, but more than that it is (the WinFlp) AND IF I recall correctly :unsure: an "early" version of the .wim format not really compatible with anything else if not (maybe) with some Longhorn releases, JFYI:

http://reboot.pro/to...30-windows-flp/

 

You can always access the Registry Offline (booting from another instance of a NT OS or booting to a PE) to experiment with that key, you can either "import" the hive or use the Offline Registry tool to that effect:

http://reboot.pro/to...fline-registry/

 

jaclaz

 

 

Interesting threads there, thanks for linking them, Jaclaz.



#196
dencorso

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If not, then do it offline, from Win PE.


I have used this (PCRegedit):
http://www.fileimpor...egedit.iso.html

It worked.


...

As a lot of you know, Windows XP 64bit does use a slightly different kernel to the original 32bit version.


No. Those kernels are actually hugely different, in fact, except on the most general conception principles.
 

Really what we wanna do is try to spoof Windows Server 2003 on XP x64.


Very true. It's the way to go for x64, all right! :yes:

#197
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re: that "HAL" difference for x64...

Didn't anyone notice the date differences?

SP2 (RTM) is the above listed Server2k3x64.

SP2 -plus- the following is what's listed for the XPx64 -

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/956841

The listed Server has apparently -not- the above fix applied.

To clear up the confusion - GDR vs QFE/LDR

http://blogs.technet...to-install.aspx

Apply that fix to Srv2k3x64 and watch it change. ;)

 

Bottom line is it's -possible- (probably) to "spoof" x64 Srvr->XP.

 

Here's an Evaluation of x64 Datacenter Edition (SP2) if anyone wants to find that "key difference" in the registry.

http://www.microsoft...e190a24fa6=True

 

HTH


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#198
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Bottom line is it's -possible- (probably) to "spoof" x64 Srvr->XP.


Sure. But since the Extended Support End Date for all types of Windows Server 2003 is 7/14/2015 (as opposed to far away 4/9/2019 for Windows Embedded POSReady 2009), those willing to find the way to make the spoof a reality should really hurry up, lest it ends up being useless.



#199
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Just a heads up for those using IE8 (or IE7): there are a few files in the IE cumulative updates, which MS only includes in the IE6 updates, but can be used by all. This is known for a long time already, since MDGx released the unofficial X2183461 (now obsolete), way back when. What is not necessarily common knowledge is that such files continue to be constantly updated. This month's KB2962872-IE6 for x86 POSReady 2009 contains, not just the usual two, but in fact three files (an update to browsewm.dll appears for the 1st time) that can be used by all, namely:

browseui.dll v. 6.0.2900.6576   1,025,024 bytes 
browsewm.dll v. 6.0.2900.6576      78,336 bytes 
shdocvw.dll  v. 6.0.2900.6576   1,510,400 bytes 

Of course, at the moment, such files must be extracted and added by hand, because there's no stand-alone installer for them.






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