[lilas]

Some statistics:

XP installation duration: 45 min on my system

On my same system, Vista Installation steps:
Copying Windows files 2 min
Expanding files 16 min
Installing features 0 min
Installing updates 1 min
Completing installation 0 min

Total: 19 min (+15 min on first startup (completing installation)). Apparently the gain over XP is by using the WIM format (install.wim about 2.5 GB), so
less files copied, and file expansion is faster.

This post has been edited by lilas: 07 October 2007 - 04:09 AM

[jaclaz]

Some "semi-random" ideas and suggestions:
@Wimb
if you check my binifix.cmd there is a small routine that checks the ATTRIB status of a file, sets it to writable, visible, non-system in order to allow modifying or overwriting, then resets attributes as before.
You can use it to overcome the reported ACCESS DENIED problem.

@lilas (aka ktp )
An interesting test would be if you could partition (temporarily) the 8Gb key to a smaller size in order to format the partition as FAT16 and see if the speed difference is due to the filesystem rather than to the controller.
See this (now getting old) comparison between different USB Flash drives (read different stick controllers) and their access and transfer speed:
http://www.hardwares...com/article/321

jaclaz

[wimb]

Using Apacer HT203 1 GB USB-stick and computer with ASUS M2A-VM HDMI motherboard I observed:

Windows XP Setup Ready in 30 minutes, composed of:

2 min - TXT Mode Setup, Loading Boot Drivers + User Interaction
12 min - TXT Mode Setup, Copy of Windows XP files
16 min - GUI Mode Setup Windows XP

wimb

This post has been edited by wimb: 11 October 2007 - 10:05 PM

[wimb]

jaclaz, on Oct 7 2007, 01:05 PM, said:

Some "semi-random" ideas and suggestions:
@Wimb
if you check my binifix.cmd there is a small routine that checks the ATTRIB status of a file, sets it to writable, visible, non-system in order to allow modifying or overwriting, then resets attributes as before.
You can use it to overcome the reported ACCESS DENIED problem.

@jaclaz
Thanks for your Info.
At the moment usb_prep3.cmd is not meant to be used for updating an USB-stick,
but may be your routine will be helpfull in future for changing ATTRIB status of e.g. existing ntldr file.

wimb

This post has been edited by wimb: 08 October 2007 - 02:37 AM

[lilas]

Found in jaclaz"s binifix.cmd:

ECHO ERROR
ECHO DefaultEntry is %DefaultEntry%
ECHO.
ECHO The rdisk value is ALREADY 0
ECHO You don't want me to set it as -1, don't you?
PAUSE

Excellent error catching! On real hardware rdisk(-1) would have bad consequences! :-)

This post has been edited by lilas: 07 October 2007 - 11:08 AM

[ilko_t]

lilas, on Oct 6 2007, 07:21 AM, said:

....Note that the logon is important to rename and change the ini entry to z-1. Since in my installation after GUI setup I do not see any logon, I
access directly to the desktop (maybe with a default user ?). So after checking that boot.ini and folders are not changed/renames, I do a manual
close session and then logon as administrator. And then I did verify that c:\boot.ini is well changed (z-1), and the two folders on the USB key
are renamed back correctly....

Is this problem still persisting?
Do you need to logon as administrator in order to execute binifix.cmd and undoren.cmd? What rights first logged user had?
If yes then we will need to use RunOnceEx.
http://unattended.ms...xp/view/web/31/

wimb, on Oct 6 2007, 11:51 AM, said:

NEW RELEASE is Available as usb_prep3.zip file in Attachment....

lilas, on Oct 7 2007, 06:03 AM, said:

....
Other remarks:
1)
We probably need a kind of execution log (maybe simply by just capturing all usb_prep3.cmd output (stdout/stderr) with
"tee" (tee.exe under Win32), e.g. usb_prep3.cmd | tee usb_prep.log), so that by browsing the log problems can be spotted
easily (and for audit/history also). Without the log, some script (like MakeBS3.cmd uses cls command so the output is cleared
in the window command prompt, so even if I have a big screen buffer, I cannot use copy-paste to report/indicate needed messages output).
.....
4) Maybe offer the option to delete the temporary image tempimage.img (after the dialog to accept unmount the temporary drive)....

good ideas

lilas, on Oct 7 2007, 06:21 AM, said:

OK, after resetting ntldr attribute on my USB key, and after unmount all drives (vdk, ImDisk...) and unplug all drives, and replug USB key,
I got associated physical drive letter.
Then the script executes smoothly without errors and my key is prepared.
So it remains to test in on real hardware, but normally success will be there. Report later.

Edit: I tried this time with hi-speed 8GB key formatted FAT32, but curiously this time the file copy by setup is very slow, much slower
than with 4GB key formatted FAT16 ! So I interrupt the process and rebuild the 8GB formatted with FAT16. Report later.

I am having similar troubles when ImDsk has mounted drive for too long, unmounting and creating a new one it fixes troubles.
Another thing- boot files position on stick is critical in most cases, a fresh format should be performed prior to using usb_prep.cmd. The script copies those files first.

lilas, on Oct 7 2007, 10:25 AM, said:

Some quick report:
- 8GB key cannot be formatted FAT16.

- Even after reformat with FAT32, 8GB hi-speed key is very slow during setup file copy (5 min to have only 10% copy complete).

- Using low-speed FAT16 4GB key freshly formatted, setup file copy is lightening fast (20 s to get 10% complete, total duration (100% complete) = 5 min) !

I believe it's the stick which is slow, many of the copied files are too small and in that case slow sticks perform really bad.
Very nice program to test your sticks speed, AFAIK backing up data is not required, but you never know...
http://www.hugesyste...ace/bench32.exe

Test on many different USB sticks, thread is in bulgarian, but pictures give very clear idea:
http://www.hardwareb...ead.php?t=92033

lilas said:

- By the way I chain the test with Vista installation from USB key: no problem so far.
The key has to be bootable, with Vista bootmanager (bootsect /nt60 or using diskpart or using grub4dos to invoke bootmgr).
The USB key content is a copy of the Vista DVD (almost 4GB).

At also should work if you use XP/2k bootsector (PEtoUSB, HP format tool...) and just rename BOOTMGR to NTLDR. Jaclaz's makeBS.cmd is also very handy if want to use multiboot with ntldr/boot.ini.

lilas said:

Question: is it really z-1 or hard coded to zero (since z=1?). What happens if I install to another partition then the first partition? also maybe on another disk
than the first disk, e.g. HDD2 (USB key, HDD1, HDD2) ? Could you confirm that these cases are covered ?

Jaclaz answered already this, just wanted to add a few things:
1. Mixed SATA/IDE devices may break order and how USB disk is seen by TXT Setup- disable or unplug the unnecessary device. Details here:
http://www.msfn.org/board/boot_install_USB...345#entry655345
2. If planning to install in disk/partition other than 0-1 then boot.ini on stick should be amended accordingly.

BTW in my old tests- 341MB source with BTS mass storage and LAN completed in 16 mins. first boot- first working desktop, Barton 2400М @ 2000, 1GB RAM and 400GB SATA disk, motherboard did not support USB2 boot, otherwise a few minutes could have been saved. USB stick- Buffalo FireStix 2GB type R RUF2-R2G-S, it's really fast stick.


To do:
1. Use NTFS compressed temp drive, this should save space, 1GB sometimes could be too much and not possible.
2. Ask to detele tempimage.img when script has completed
3. If needed use RunOnceEx instead of GuiRunOnce to execute binifix.cmd and undoren.cmd. Possibly merge these 2 scripts.
4. USB hard drives- reverse dummydisk.sys logic
5. May be add Vista support too? Shouldn't take much effort.

Regards,
ilko

[lilas]

Quote

ilko_t
Is this problem still persisting?

The problem is solved now, since with usb_prep3.cmd no more automatic logon. You have to manually logon. I used administrator, but maybe UserXP should be OK too.

Quote

ilko_t
1. Use NTFS compressed temp drive, this should save space, 1GB sometimes could be too much and not possible.

Yes, maybe mksparse to use at least (quicker).

Quote

ilko_t
5. May be add Vista support too? Shouldn't take much effort.

Possible, but the stick must be > 4GB due to the size of Vista DVD (almost 4 GB) and XP CD (could be bigger than 750 MB due to custom addons, service packs, slipstream etc..)

[lilas]

A tool to test your USB key (speed...):
http://www.flashmemorytoolkit.com/

[lilas]

Quote

ilko_t
I am having similar troubles when ImDsk has mounted drive for too long, unmounting and creating a new one it fixes troubles.

Personally ImDisk does not cause any problem, it does not create new physical hard drive (no partition).
The problem was with vdk. Even if you close the drive (vdk close 0 e.g.) the associated physical drive remains listed and is seen
by other utilities (vmware, drive snapshot) but they cannot access them (drive not ready). The only clean way is to uninstall vdk
(vdk remove). By this way, all the physical drive descriptors are removed.

[wimb]

ilko_t, on Oct 7 2007, 10:39 PM, said:

BTW in my old tests- 341MB source with BTS mass storage and LAN completed in 16 mins. first boot- first working desktop, Barton 2400М @ 2000, 1GB RAM and 400GB SATA disk, motherboard did not support USB2 boot, otherwise a few minutes could have been saved. USB stick- Buffalo FireStix 2GB type R RUF2-R2G-S, it's really fast stick.

16 min - That is very FAST INDEED for Windows XP Install from USB-stick,
most probably due to the very fast Buffalo FireStix USB-stick.

@lilas
Interesting that Install of Vista from USB-stick can be supported in a rather simple way.

@lilas and @ilko_t
Thanks for all the interesting references concerning speed measurements on USB-sticks.

wimb

This post has been edited by wimb: 08 October 2007 - 01:31 AM

[jaclaz]

The idea of a log file is excellent.

Cannot say if it would cause slowness, in the procedure, but before a separate tee.exe, I would try to use the .bat/.cmd version, available on Rob van der Woude's site:
http://www.robvanderwoude.com/tee.html
integrating it in the main batch.

jaclaz

[wimb]

jaclaz, on Oct 8 2007, 01:43 PM, said:

The idea of a log file is excellent.

Cannot say if it would cause slowness, in the procedure, but before a separate tee.exe, I would try to use the .bat/.cmd version, available on Rob van der Woude's site:
http://www.robvanderwoude.com/tee.html
integrating it in the main batch.

I did some experiments with tee.exe from http://www.robvanderwoude.com/tee.html
using:

usb_prep3.cmd | tee usbtee.log

The problem with tee from robvanderwoude is that good user interaction fails,
because Answers have to be given before the actual Question appears on screen.
The examples with PERL TEE.PL usbtee.log and REGINA TEE.REX usbtee.log did not work for me,
because PERL ( = renamed tee.exe ) was using TEE.PL as log file, instead of giving usbtee.log
The TEE.BAT Example gives the output on screen after the program has ended,
so that is not so usefull in this form.

Then I tried tee.exe in GnuWin32 Package CoreUtils from http://gnuwin32.sour...t/packages.html
In this case all Questions appear on screen and the usbtee.log file is OK.
However for using the small program tee.exe ( = 24 KB ) there are
two additional large files required ( libintl3.dll = 100 KB and libiconv2.dll = 877 KB)

Maybe TEE.BAT can be integrated in usb_prep3.cmd
Some more experiments are required.

regards,

wimb

This post has been edited by wimb: 09 October 2007 - 03:44 AM

[jaclaz]

@Wimb

Yes, I know it would be a lot of work, but you don't actually need to log really everything, the tee.bat works only for "simple" commands, it needs to be integrated in the batch to work in this procedure.

Also, if you wish, feel free to integrate the "working part" of both binifix and MakeBS into the main batch.

jaclaz

[wimb]

NEW RELEASE is Available as usb_prep4.zip file in Attachment.

The Programm Flow is recorded in LogFile usb_prep.log , without file details
Giving the filecopy details in this logfile, results in losing them on screen, which is unwanted !!

For fedit -add the option -once was used to correct for
multiple entries in [SourceDisksFiles] section.
Thanks to jaclaz for finding this non-fatal error and some other improvements

When all output on screen with all file details is desired in a logfile, the solution is:
Download GnuWin32 Package CoreUtils from http://gnuwin32.sour...t/packages.html
Place tee.exe = 24 KB, libintl3.dll = 100 KB and libiconv2.dll = 877 KB in usb_prep4 folder
Use the following command to start usb_prep4

usb_prep4.cmd | tee usbtee.log

In this case the Dialogue and all File Details appear on screen and in the usbtee.log

Regards,

wimb

Attached File(s)

•  usb_prep4.zip (107.94K)
  Number of downloads: 37

This post has been edited by wimb: 12 October 2007 - 02:20 AM

[effgee]

I have successfully accomplished this install using the guide.
This is a crosspost from

http://www.msfn.org/board/Install_XP_USB_t...tml#entry701945

As I am not sure whether everyone will get to read this on page 20+.. heh

A few notes,


Stock XP VLK install works seamlessly.
I first attempted using the Grub bootloader, works fine.
Now I am using the extracted bootsector, renamed to skip using GRUB and boot directly from NTLDR into the TXTMODE SETUP.
This process was posted by ilko_t here
http://www.msfn.org/board/boot_install_USB...376#entry671376
Also works fine.

Here's the next problem.
Trying to install a custom XP build. RVM/NLITE/YADAYADA

Addon most of the current hotfixes and extras such as WMP11 and IE7.

Important note about Nlite and RVM customized XPs for USB.
Make sure to use
winnt32 /makelocalsource:all /unattend:winnt.sif /noreboot
The /unattend:winnt.sif makes sure that the nlite version of the winnt.sif is used.
Yes, you still have to edit it and remove the [Unattended] section.
I didn't at first and because it didn't give me the choice of which disk / partition to use,
it said my drive F: (usb disk) was corrupt and unfixable.



First problem - SOLVED
During TXTMODE it asks for the Windows XP SP2 Disc 2 -
This is fixed using /makelocalsource:all
The guide needs to reflect that.
While using this switch, there was a bunch of missing files (for Tablet PC and Media Center? versions.) I skipped those files.

Second problem - SOLVED - but needs some work.

Second problem, during textmode it asks for quite a few dlls and files that are MISSING from the /makelocalsource:all copy.
These files are present in my i386 (nlited and rvmi) source directory.
A few of them are , kbdhc.dll , kbdiultn.dll , kbdnepr.dll and more.
I solved this by copying all of the .dll files from my i386 (nlited and rvmi) source in to the $WIN_NT$.~LS directory on my USB stick. I did not overwrite files.

Then setup gets a bit further and starts to ask for some driver files. Specifically amdk6.sys and amdk7.sys

To fix this I extracted driver.cab and copied the entire thing into my $WIN_NT$.~LS directory as well. Once again I did not overwrite files.

At this point the installation is continuing.
Can someone tell me why these steps are necessary ? Did I do something wrong?
Also I have been following the whole process in all the various threads, I still don't understand what the binifix is for? Can someone explain?

[effgee]

The next step that I am unsure on how to progress is using the DriverPacks.

I just found the prepare_USB.zip which has something in there to assist, but I haven't had a chance to look at the command.

If someone has integrated the Driverpacks with the USB install could they chime in with their steps?

[ilko_t]

@effgee

All the issues you mentioned were taken care of in usb_prep.cmd and it's last versions, including BTS drivers packs, RVM, Nlite stuff, tablet/media files...

The guides are outdated, still could be used as a very basic start, but most improvements were done in USB_PREP.CMD, which you may want to have a look at to see all steps performed.

binifix.cmd is to set BOOT.INI on destination drive from rdisk(Z) to rdisk(Z-1), because Text mode setup sets it according to the current setup, USB drive is first (you booted from it), IDE hard disk gets second and so on. When you remove USB stick for regular usage, IDE disk becomes first ( rdisk(0) ), but in BOOT.INI you have rdisk(1), that's why binifix.cmd makes it Z-1.

Regards,
ilko

[effgee]

ilko_t

I am still having some problems with installing from usb.

During the txtmode setup process, it asks for some missing files.
kbdbhc.dll


and I'm sure it will also ask about missing driver files.



As in my previous post, these files are not copied when /makelocalsource or /makelocalsource:all is called.
But they do exist my i386 source directory.

My previous fix, to copy the *.dll from the source seems to work, but do you have any ideas what is going on?

I am using the usb_prep4 to setup the usb stick.

This post has been edited by effgee: 17 October 2007 - 11:44 AM

[ilko_t]

effgee, on Oct 17 2007, 06:10 PM, said:

ilko_t

I am still having some problems with installing from usb.

During the txtmode setup process, it asks for some missing files.
kbdbhc.dll


and I'm sure it will also ask about missing driver files.



As in my previous post, these files are not copied when /makelocalsource or /makelocalsource:all is called.
But they do exist my i386 source directory.

My previous fix, to copy the *.dll from the source seems to work, but do you have any ideas what is going on?

Did you select 0 for "MCE / Tablet - NLite", was "currently"... showing this?
Script is supposed to copy all files from source\I386 to $WIN_NT$.~LS\I386, thus eliminating all possible issues with missing files/folders. This happens ONLY when for source type "MCE / Tablet - NLite" is selected in order not to copy unneeded files with not customized sources.

............
IF "%xp_type%" == "MCE / Tablet - NLite" (
   ECHO.
   ECHO Media Center/Tablet PC - NLite require extra xcopy of i386 folder to have all files in LocalSource !
   ECHO.
   pause
   xcopy %xpsource%\i386\*.* %tmpdrive%\$WIN_NT$.~LS\I386\ /i /k /e /y /h
   echo >> usb_prep.log Extra xcopy of i386 folder necessary for MCE / Tablet - NLite Ready
)...........

[effgee]

Well, that would be it.
I'm trying it now with a Greek version of XP.

I'll let you know how it goes.

And thanks for yours and everyone else involved hard work!!

This post has been edited by effgee: 17 October 2007 - 02:32 PM