Gape

98 SE SP 3.32

2,361 posts in this topic

Within the next couple of weeks, i plan on wiping my main system (P4, 845, USB 2.0) and doing a clean Win98SE install with uSP 3.1. But first, before i do that -- as a just-to-see-what-happens experiment -- i'm going to try uSP 3.1 over the pre-existing Win98SE installation... with all my apps, utilities, drivers, updates (e.g,, uSP 3.0b4, 98SE2ME, etc), extensions (e.g., KernelEx, RP9, etc) already in place.

However, i have a few lingering USB-related questions... so i don't screw it up, and hopefully my feedback will be more meaningful.

I know you have to unplug all external USB devices, then install Main Updates, then go into Safe Mode on reboot and remove "all current USB/EHCI drivers + controllers" (as it says).

Question 1: Does this mean only USB 2.0/EHCI? (Or all USB, including EHCI (1.0, 1,1, 2.0)?)

On my system, when no USB devices are plugged in, the following list is the only Device Manager category which appears to be USB related. I assume all of them are "system" devices (i.e., not plug-in devices). Note that i have Intel Chipset Driver and NUSB 3.3 already installed (my notation "(x3)" means there are 3 of these listed -- the system unit has 6 physical USB sockets):


Universal Serial Bus controllers
Intel(R) 82891DB/DBM (ICH4 Family) USB2 Enhanced Host Controller - 24CD
Standard Universal PCI to USB Controller (x3)
USB 2.0 Root Hub
USB Root Hub (x3)

Question 2: Which of the above need to be removed? (I assume "USB 2.0 Root Hub" does, but any of the others?)

Question 3: In Safe Mode, do i need to remove non-mass-storage plug-in USB devices? (For example, things like a cable modem or scanner)?

Thanks, and i'll report back how it goes....

- Doug B.

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Question 1: Does this mean only USB 2.0/EHCI? (Or all USB, including EHCI (1.0, 1,1, 2.0)?)

- Doug B.

IT MEANS ALL :realmad: No offense to you Doug B, but I am sick and tired of answering the Remove All USB issue.

If its asked again because people can't comprehend what (ALL) means I will remove (ALL) USB drivers.

Then we won't have this problem in the future.

USB 2.0 NOTICE - Unplug all USB devices. Install main updates.

Remove all current USB/EHCI drivers + controllers from Device Manager in safe mode. REBOOT!

Let all drivers redetect on startup. Plug in USB devices one at a time.

Maximus Decim Native USB ver.3.3

------------------------------------------------------------------------

*Native (without installation of additional drivers for each type) support USB flash drives, digital photo

and videocameras and other similar devices.

*Universal Stack USB 2.0 (without installation of additional drivers for each chipsets) with uninstall.

1.Remove ALL drivers USB flash drives.

2.Remove ALL drivers USB 2.0 controllers.

3.Remove ALL unknown devices.

4.Install NUSB 3.3 and reboot.

5.After detection new USB 2.0 controllers (if it will occur) too it is necessary to be reboot.

Remember! You install it at own risk!

This driver is created from Windows 2000 SP4 USB 2.0 stack by SweetLow from russian Ru-Board forum.

http://sweetlow.at.tut.by/download/usb2.zip

This is an expirimental build, i'm uploading it because i don't have enough Win98 park.

Please try it if you can/want.

Remove current USB/EHCI drivers (and their .inf files if there are), delete EHCI controllers from Device Manager.

You can also try to install it by right-click.

Feedback appreciated.

They'll be included into newer NUSB version if positive :rolleyes:

The key word is Remove followed by the word (ALL) Edited by PROBLEMCHYLD
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I even asked that question when 3.0 was first released. And I read the instructions. I can understand a question becoming boring torture. Maybe a quick edit of the black release instructions might help. Something like .....

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

USB 2.0 NOTICE - Unplug all USB devices. Install main updates.

Remove ALL current USB/EHCI drivers + controllers from Device Manager in safe mode.

"All" means "ALL YOU SEE". You wouldn't believe how many people don't get what "all" means.:)

Then, REBOOT!

Let all drivers redetect on startup. Plug in USB devices one at a time.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'd certainly understand that wording. Of course, you'll still get a few who still won't get it and will ask again.:)

By the way, I'm still having so much fun with 3.1 as well as a few of the Revolutions skins on several old systems. I'm sort of bouncing between these installs and checking out windows 8 on other systems. Such a long trip from the dos days.

Edited by billyb
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Question 1: Does this mean only USB 2.0/EHCI? (Or all USB, including EHCI (1.0, 1,1, 2.0)?)

IT MEANS ALL :realmad: No offense to you Doug B, but I am sick and tired of answering the Remove All USB issue.

If its asked again because people can't comprehend what (ALL) means I will remove (ALL) USB drivers.

Then we won't have this problem in the future.

Maximus Decim Native USB ver.3.3

------------------------------------------------------------------------

*Native (without installation of additional drivers for each type) support USB flash drives, digital photo

and videocameras and other similar devices.

*Universal Stack USB 2.0 (without installation of additional drivers for each chipsets) with uninstall.

1.Remove ALL drivers USB flash drives.

2.Remove ALL drivers USB 2.0 controllers.

3.Remove ALL unknown devices.

4.Install NUSB 3.3 and reboot.

5.After detection new USB 2.0 controllers (if it will occur) too it is necessary to be reboot.

Remember! You install it at own risk!

The key word is Remove followed by the word (ALL)

I believe the confusion arises from the differences between NUSB 3.3 and NUSB 3.5.

NUSB 3.3 and EARLIER only require removal of USB2 and USB Storage Devices & Drivers.

NUSB 3.5 and likely any FUTURE versions require removal of ALL USB Devices, period.

@PROBLEMCHYLD

Might help to quote maximus-decim on NUSB 3.5 instead of 3.3. ;)

Maximus Decim Native USB ver.3.5

------------------------------------------------------------------------

*Native (without installation of additional drivers for each type) support USB flash drives, digital photo

and videocameras and other similar devices.

*Universal Stack USB 2.0 (without installation of additional drivers for each chipsets) with uninstall.

1.Remove ALL drivers USB flash drives.

2.Remove ALL drivers USB 2.0 controllers.

3.Remove ALL USB 1.1 and 2.0 controllers and devices.

4.Remove ALL unknown devices.

5.Install NUSB 3.5 and reboot.

6.After detection new USB 1.1 and 2.0 controllers (if it will occur) too it is necessary to reboot.

Remember! You install it at own risk!

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

English: http://www.zshare.net/download/934510417a4f04d9/

Russian: http://www.zshare.net/download/934510631daab5ad/

What's new?

*OPENHCI.SYS 4.90.3000.1

*UHCD.SYS 4.90.3000.1

*USBD.SYS 4.90.3000.1

*USBHUB.SYS 4.90.3002.1

*USBCCGP.SYS 5.1.2600.5585

*USB.INF 01.01 ( LoneCrusader)

*USBSTOR.INF 01.10dt (dencorso, add new devices)

*USB2.INF 01.01 (MD, add new devices)

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I believe the confusion arises from the differences between NUSB 3.3 and NUSB 3.5.

NUSB 3.3 and EARLIER only require removal of USB2 and USB Storage Devices & Drivers.

NUSB 3.5 and likely any FUTURE versions require removal of ALL USB Devices, period.

@PROBLEMCHYLD

Might help to quote maximus-decim on NUSB 3.5 instead of 3.3. ;)

There wouldn't be any confusion if people followed instructions. The instructions specifically says REMOVE ALL DEVICES.

Not some, not a couple, but ALL. Why are peolpe following NUSB instructions? The heck if I know.

They should be following the Service Pack instructions. If my one year old daughter can understand

All when asked to pick up her toys, then any adult should be able to do it also.

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I believe the confusion arises from the differences between NUSB 3.3 and NUSB 3.5.

NUSB 3.3 and EARLIER only require removal of USB2 and USB Storage Devices & Drivers.

NUSB 3.5 and likely any FUTURE versions require removal of ALL USB Devices, period.

@PROBLEMCHYLD

Might help to quote maximus-decim on NUSB 3.5 instead of 3.3. ;)

There wouldn't be any confusion if people followed instructions. The instructions specifically says REMOVE ALL DEVICES.

Not some, not a couple, but ALL. Why are peolpe following NUSB instructions? The heck if I know.

They should be following the Service Pack instructions. If my one year old daughter can understand

All when asked to pick up her toys, then any adult should be able to do it also.

Finding ALL Devices may not be so easy, especially if using USB Keyboards and/or Mice. Some Drivers are hidden under "Human Interface Devices" for example.

Also removing ALL Devices may be difficult. On my MA785 Computer either my Keyboard or Mouse must be USB. Some Computers require both to be USB. Others may have internally mounted USB Devices.

The !README.TXT in NUSB35E.TXT fails to mention using Safe Mode. It also tells you to remove the Controllers, which is impractical.

It should not be necessary to remove Devices if installing from Safe Mode as they are not detected.

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LOL.

I asked the question about "all" devices two months ago and I see that we are still talking about it today.

I also find wierd that one should remove all USB devices eventhought they have nothing to do with storage.

As a result you have to browse through all the system device classification tree just in case a USB thing would be there, where you least expected. As RLoew said, you may find out that your mouse and keyboard are also USB devices. How do you proceed once they are disabled, I don't know.

Finaly you will have to reinstall half a dozen NON-storage devices for they came with a USB connection.

But if these are the instruction...

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You guys can direct all USB related questions to members Tihiy, MDGx, and maximus-decim.

They are the founders of the USB packages. You can ask them why all devices should be removed.

I followed their instructions and gave them to you.

The next version of the Service Pack will (NOT) have any usb support. Enjoy :thumbup

Maximus Decim Native USB ver.3.6

------------------------------------------------------------------------

*Native (without installation of additional drivers for each type) support USB flash drives, digital photo

and videocameras and other similar devices.

*Universal Stack USB 2.0 (without installation of additional drivers for each chipsets) with uninstall.

1.Remove ALL drivers USB flash drives.

2.Remove ALL drivers USB 2.0 controllers.

3.Remove ALL USB 1.1 and 2.0 controllers and devices.

4.Remove ALL unknown devices.

5.Install NUSB 3.6 and reboot.

6.After detection new USB 1.1 and 2.0 controllers (if it will occur) too it is necessary to reboot.

Remember! You install it at own risk!

This driver is created from Windows 2000 SP4 USB 2.0 stack by SweetLow from russian Ru-Board forum.

http://sweetlow.at.tut.by/download/usb2.zip

http://tihiy.ahanix.org/usb2.zip

This is an expirimental build, i'm uploading it because i don't have enough Win98 park.

Please try it if you can/want.

Remove current USB/EHCI drivers (and their .inf files if there are), delete EHCI controllers from Device Manager.

You can also try to install it by right-click.

Feedback appreciated.

They'll be included into newer NUSB version if positive :rolleyes:

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I also find wierd that one should remove all USB devices eventhought they have nothing to do with storage.

Because NUSB 3.5 (and by extension the Service Pack) replaces all of the USB Driver stack files. That includes ALL USB devices, not just storage.

If one installs either of these packages without first removing devices, it can lead to problems, such as those described by Drugwash in the NUSB thread.

Edited by LoneCrusader
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The next version of the Service Pack will (NOT) have any usb support. Enjoy

PROBLEMCHYLD, I hope you will reconsider your decision and continue to include the latest Maximus Decim Native USB, now at ver.3.6, in your Service Pack. While I completely understand your frustration with users not reading the instructions then complaining to you when it doesn't work, I think the convenience for those that do read and follow the instructions should override that. You should not feel required to explain yourself to those that complain, a simple "RTFM" could suffice. If they continue to complain, I'm sure one of the other users will be glad to step in and tell them explicitly that they have to remove ALL USB devices, even if they have to borrow an old style keyboard and mouse to use until the USB stack is reinstalled. If rloew could verify that the Service Pack can be installed in Safe Mode without removing devices that could be an alternate solution.

Cheers and Regards

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Because NUSB 3.5 (and by extension the Service Pack) replaces all of the USB Driver stack files. That includes ALL USB devices, not just storage.

If one installs either of these packages without first removing devices, it can lead to problems, such as those described by Drugwash in the NUSB thread.

PROBLEMCHYLD, I hope you will reconsider your decision and continue to include the latest Maximus Decim Native USB, now at ver.3.6, in your Service Pack. While I completely understand your frustration with users not reading the instructions then complaining to you when it doesn't work, I think the convenience for those that do read and follow the instructions should override that. You should not feel required to explain yourself to those that complain, a simple "RTFM" could suffice. If they continue to complain, I'm sure one of the other users will be glad to step in and tell them explicitly that they have to remove ALL USB devices, even if they have to borrow an old style keyboard and mouse to use until the USB stack is reinstalled. If rloew could verify that the Service Pack can be installed in Safe Mode without removing devices that could be an alternate solution.

Cheers and Regards

I hope people are reading what you guys wrote. It’s repetitious, so maybe you guys can deal with it. How many times one must say (REMOVE ALL)?

Finding ALL Devices may not be so easy, especially if using USB Keyboards and/or Mice. Some Drivers are hidden under "Human Interface Devices" for example.

Also removing ALL Devices may be difficult. On my MA785 Computer either my Keyboard or Mouse must be USB. Some Computers require both to be USB. Others may have internally mounted USB Devices.

The !README.TXT in NUSB35E.TXT fails to mention using Safe Mode. It also tells you to remove the Controllers, which is impractical.

It should not be necessary to remove Devices if installing from Safe Mode as they are not detected.

I thought USB devices can only be loaded in Safe Mode through USB Legacy Support if the BIOS supports it?

Not everyone have this option. So we should focus on the majority (atm).

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I also find wierd that one should remove all USB devices eventhought they have nothing to do with storage.

Because NUSB 3.5 (and by extension the Service Pack) replaces all of the USB Driver stack files. That includes ALL USB devices, not just storage.

If one installs either of these packages without first removing devices, it can lead to problems, such as those described by Drugwash in the NUSB thread.

Clearly removing Storage Devices is necessary as the drivers have been changed.

In the case of non-storage Devices, it would be necessary only if different Drivers would be chosen and/or the Registry Interface has been altered. Otherwise they would be found after the Controller Drivers are installed.

Someone should test different USB Devices to see which ones need to be removed or not. Some, like the Keyboard and Mouse, probably do not need to be removed.

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I've compared some of the files from SP3.CAB with the ones I have in my system. I don't know if they are compatible with Win98SE but this is what I found out:

ASYCFILT.DLL 2.40.4530.0 => 2.40.4534.0

msjet40.dll 4.0.9511.0 => 4.0.9514.0

OLEAUT32.DLL 2.40.4520.0 => 2.40.4532.1

RICHED20.DLL 5.30.23.1230 => 5.30.23.1231

T2EMBED.DLL 5.0.2195.7348 => 5.0.2195.7349

You can find them here:

http://www.evernote.com/shard/s144/sh/5b1f1a16-df65-48bb-bd61-a4418ef6afee/bcdfed00f8a08f60be6d06286b2243af

I also don't know about the compatiblity of the MS VC++ libraries but I think I may have some newer versions in UURollup.

Edited by tomasz86
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How many times one must say (REMOVE ALL)?

42 (at least).

How many roads must a man walk down before .....?

Approximately the same number of times one must say RTFM and ground ALL equipment used to unbrick the 7200.110s :whistle:

JFYI:

etc., etc.

I guess 50% of my posts in the related thread ONLY provide these three directions:

  1. Read the read-me-first FIRST
  2. do EXACTLY what is in it and in the advised guide
  3. ground ALL items (and loop to #1)

BUT specifically, and if I may :ph34r:, there should be a way to add in the installer/whatever *something* that automatically removes anything that needs to be removed prior of the installtion of NUSB :unsure: it would be a "quantum leap" for a next version....

jaclaz

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Updated list from #1423:

Filename U98SESP3 Win2000


ASYCFILT.DLL 2.40.4530.0 2.40.4534.0

msjet40.dll 4.0.9511.0 4.0.9514.0

OLEAUT32.DLL 2.40.4520.0 2.40.4532.1

RICHED20.DLL 5.30.23.1230 5.30.23.1231

T2EMBED.DLL 5.0.2195.7348 5.0.2195.7349

DISPEX.DLL 5.7.0.16535 5.7.0.16599

JSCRIPT.DLL 5.7.0.16535 5.8.6001.23259

MSADCE.DLL 2.81.1117.0 2.81.3010.0

MSADO15.DLL 2.81.1128.0 2.81.1145.0

MSADOMD.DLL 2.81.1128.0 2.81.1145.0

MSADOX.DLL 2.81.1128.0 2.81.1145.0

MSJRO.DLL 2.81.1128.0 2.81.1145.0

ODBCBCP.DLL 2000.85.1128.0 2000.85.3009.0

SCROBJ.DLL 5.7.0.16535 5.7.0.18066

SCRRUN.DLL 5.7.0.16535 5.7.0.18066

SQLOLEDB.DLL 2000.85.1128.0 2000.85.3006.0

SQLSRV32.DLL 2000.85.1128.0 2000.85.3009.0

VBSCRIPT.DLL 5.6.0.8838 5.8.6001.23141

WSHCON.DLL 5.7.0.16535 5.7.0.16599

WSHEXT.DLL 5.7.0.16535 5.7.0.18066

http://www.evernote.com/shard/s144/sh/5b1f1a16-df65-48bb-bd61-a4418ef6afee/bcdfed00f8a08f60be6d06286b2243af

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