[PROBLEMCHYLD]

A friend told me it is better 2 build your own computer.
Now i have computers that r proprietory but upgrade is limited.
So i gonna build my own from scratch.
All you speacialist, your input is needed.

[hougtimo]

If you're building a PC, surely your going to want a decent OS on it?? I would highly reccomend Windows 2000, XP PRO or Windows 2003, but definately NOT a 9x system!

If you want a cheap pc, I would go for a 754 Sempron, get a mobo with 3+ PCI slots and an AGP slot. maybe an ATI Radeon, 128mb should do.

If you want a nice (mid range PC) for for a 939 Athlon X2, theyre still cheap and performance ispractically unlimited. You will get PCI-e graphics with that 2.

Either machine will be cheap (less than £1700)

Hope this helps

HougTimo

[Chozo4]

hougtimo, on Mar 13 2006, 08:55 AM, said:

If you're building a PC, surely your going to want a decent OS on it?? I would highly reccomend Windows 2000, XP PRO or Windows 2003, but definately NOT a 9x system!

*cough* Windows 98se IS a decent OS *cough* He posted it here in a windows 98 forum so surely he wants win98.

As far as hardware goes, you just need to research it. Most stuff you can buy still support win98.

To start, all processors support win98, hands down so that shouldn't be a tough choice. pick the fastest you can get. However, you need to pick a mainboard that is supported. Look around and check out the specs on several mainboards for sale. Then check the manufacturers site to see if they supply drivers for it.

There honestly isn't much of a 'whats best' moreso than what is best to 'you' as far as the market goes right now. The best could be best performance or perhaps the best could be the best price for what your getting.

This post has been edited by Chozo4: 13 March 2006 - 06:39 PM

[hougtimo]

I am sorry but 98SE is NOT a decent OS, in any concievable manner. I can not imagine why anybody would want to run an ancient peice of crapware. The system is not easily customized (services wise) and 2000 / NT based OSes provide much more scope for higher performance tweaks. Aswell as that, a lot of modern applications do not run on 9X operating systems anymore. Why would someone build a system capable of running high-spec applications (also most processors these days are 64-bit, so why run a 32-bit OS?) and then stick an operating system that will prohibit the computer from being used to its fll potential. It just doesnt make sense.

HougTimo

[LLXX]

hougtimo, on Mar 14 2006, 04:58 AM, said:

I am sorry but 98SE is NOT a decent OS, in any concievable manner. I can not imagine why anybody would want to run an ancient peice of crapware. The system is not easily customized (services wise) and 2000 / NT based OSes provide much more scope for higher performance tweaks. Aswell as that, a lot of modern applications do not run on 9X operating systems anymore. Why would someone build a system capable of running high-spec applications (also most processors these days are 64-bit, so why run a 32-bit OS?) and then stick an operating system that will prohibit the computer from being used to its fll potential. It just doesnt make sense.

HougTimo

Go back to the XP/NT forum where you belong and post here http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?showtopic=69735&st=0

Get the fastest hardware you can. 98se will fly on it.

This post has been edited by LLXX: 14 March 2006 - 06:08 AM

[randiroo76073]

hougtimo, what you fail to realize is: 1. Your in a "Windows95/98/98se/ME" forum. 2. Not everyone reasons the way you do[thankfully]. 3. We've been down this road before, and are thoroughly tired of 9x bashers coming to this forum, so take it somewhere else or put a sock in in it!

[Lunac]

Hougtimo, you say "less than £1700"... for what?! Heart surgery?! I put together a brand new system for myself over the past 3 weeks or so and it didn't cost me anywhere near "£1700". Total cost after rebates and after selling old parts on ebay is $27(US)! That's right, I got new motherboard, CPU (Still waiting for this part), a Thermaltake v7000c case, modular Ultra 500watt titanium PSU, 1GB of Buffalo RAM (running in dual channel @ 2-2-2-6 with my current Athlon XP 2400+, still waiting for the new CPU), EVGA 6600GT video card (used from ebay), bunch a round cables, Aerogate II fan/thermal module, Thermaltake Volcano 11+ heatsink/fan, some silver paste for my CPU, new optical mouse, and Hunter Gaming Keyboard...all this for $27 dollars! (after rebates and selling all my old stuff on ebay) Only thing I didn't upgrade was my hard drives. I didn't need to. I got 1x160GB and 1x30GB HDs I bought over the last few years.

NT users prove they are dumbass consumers with every goddamn thing they say.

£1700?! I could build a space shuttle for that much dough. Dumb-mother%^#$(#@!


PROBLEMCHYLD, how much money you got to work with and how fast do you need this system up and running?

Do you intend to sell your old components? Also are you planning a complete upgrade, or just few components (CPU/Mobo/RAM)?

[PROBLEMCHYLD]

Lunac, on Mar 14 2006, 09:24 AM, said:

Hougtimo, you say "less than £1700"... for what?! Heart surgery?! I put together a brand new system for myself over the past 3 weeks or so and it didn't cost me anywhere near "£1700". Total cost after rebates and after selling old parts on ebay is $27(US)! That's right, I got new motherboard, CPU (Still waiting for this part), a Thermaltake v7000c case, modular Ultra 500watt titanium PSU, 1GB of Buffalo RAM (running in dual channel @ 2-2-2-6 with my current Athlon XP 2400+, still waiting for the new CPU), EVGA 6600GT video card (used from ebay), bunch a round cables, Aerogate II fan/thermal module, Thermaltake Volcano 11+ heatsink/fan, some silver paste for my CPU, new optical mouse, and Hunter Gaming Keyboard...all this for $27 dollars! (after rebates and selling all my old stuff on ebay) Only thing I didn't upgrade was my hard drives. I didn't need to. I got 1x160GB and 1x30GB HDs I bought over the last few years.

NT users prove they are dumbass consumers with every goddamn thing they say.

£1700?! I could build a space shuttle for that much dough. Dumb-mother%^#$(#@!


PROBLEMCHYLD, how much money you got to work with and how fast do you need this system up and running?

Do you intend to sell your old components? Also are you planning a complete upgrade, or just few components (CPU/Mobo/RAM)?

no i gonna keep old parts. and $500 in usa

ati or nvidia
intel or amd
i'm not 2 familiar with sound cards so input is needed

This post has been edited by PROBLEMCHYLD: 14 March 2006 - 11:32 AM

[Lunac]

Now you didn't specify if you wanted a complete system so I can only give you some general hardware Win9x guidelines.

For a motherboard I would definitely recommend something with nVidia's nForce chipset (nForce2 based motherboards can be had for $35, nForce3 for $45-$50), and both nForce2 and nForce3 are supported by Win9x. I can vouch for this as I own both nForce2 and nForce3 based motherboards. VIA boards are not bad either, but expect to take a 5-15% performance hit compared to equivalent nForceX based boards, depending on the chipset of course. Also, VIA motherboards are not that good when it comes to power tweaking or overclocking.

A decent AMD CPU (Semprons can be gotten cheap and are pretty good overclockers) along with a nice GeForce video card (6600GT, or a aftermarket 6800GT), AGP of course. Hard drives are pretty cheap too. My friend got his retail 200GB IDE Maxtor for $43 plus tax just yesterday @ Staples. After instore discounts and coupons he paid like $50 on the spot and walked away with a 200GB HD. You can get a 320GB HD on Newegg for about $115.

You can get 1-2GB of RAM for cheap nowadays, with rebates and some luck. I saw a 2GB (2x1GB dual ddr kit) deal the other day for $110. By good RAM I mean pretty much any RAM. Last November I had a chance to chat both with Mushkin and Corsair reps and what they told me about their QC and marketing techniques would make you think twice about buying "brand" name RAM. Like the fact they buy their ICs from whoever gives them the best price. Many times there is no difference between their value and performance lines except in packaging and branding. No joke. Their words, whoever gives them the best price gets to supply them with ICs. Quality does not even enter into the process. I bought the cheapest 1GB of RAM I could get my hands on, and it surprised the heck out of me.

Sound? Unless you are a "professional" (artist, sound engineer, etc), and aren't working on a homebrew media box of some sort, don't have some 12 speaker theater setup, then 4-6 channel built-in sound solutions should be more than fine for ya.

[PROBLEMCHYLD]

Thanx I keep a open mind on what u listed, just incase others have som'n 2 say if not
I'll go with what u suggested
And yes i will be working on music /engineerin etc.

This post has been edited by PROBLEMCHYLD: 14 March 2006 - 01:00 PM

[Lunac]

No problem. It has been my experience that it's the speakers and not the sound card that you should throw your money on. Cheap speakers can turn a $200+ sound card into a $9 sound card.

[Eck]

If you don't mind Socket A you can save some money. Newegg has a Foxconn 748K7AA that I've been running for a couple of weeks now. It is not an overclockers board, especially on 9x as the SuperUtilities overclocking within Windows only can do that type of thing on XP and the bios is limited in this area. (But the SuperUtilities monitor does run on 98SE even though they say it only supports XP)

I have been using Via Chipsets for years, but found some of the same problems others have with AGP 8x and 400FSB with them. So since I wanted to keep using my Socket A processors for awhile, I decided to experiment with this SiS748/SiS946L chipset board.

Unlike Via, it does not suffer from crashes when gaming at 400FSB speeds.

I use my own soundcard and Ethernet card as you can do better than what is built in. For Ethernet I have a D-Link DGE530T (Marvell GigaLAN) and for sound an Audigy 2 ZS Platinum Pro. You don't need the Platinum unless you want the extra connections. If you don't mind installing software midi synthesizers like WinGroove if you like midi better than Microsoft provides, then an M-Audio Revolution is an excellent alternative. The 5.1's are newer with slightly better DAC's and SNR than the 7.1. The Revo is better for sound quality, but the Creative cards are better if you want the best FPS in gaming since the Revo does EAX in software. (Still works fine though.)

For a cpu, although I already have an AthlonXP 3200+ 400FSB Barton I noticed that directron.com is selling a Sempron 3300+ Socket A 400FSB for less than half the price of my old AthlonXP 3200+. It is an HP OEM processor that is a relabled AthlonXP 3200+! Same thing. So I bought it as a backup or to replace the AthlonXP 3000+ 333FSB on my second box.

Crucial is the memory I usually buy. The auto finder there does not list this board but if you instead put in an Asus A7V880 it will show the memory for that board and it all is also compatible with the Foxconn 748K7AA.

I'm partial to ATI Radeon's for my videocards. Don't know why, just used to them. My main system has an x850PRO. I got it because I wanted an upgrade from the 9600XT and it was on sale. There are now even better choices for the same money with the newer models, but ATI now supports the x850 series with the Catalyst drivers (though the Windows Me driver) on 98SE. They call it beta support but all features work with the Catalyst 6.2. ATI MMC 9.13 and the DVD also work fine. I'm not sure if the decoder will download onto a 9x system though. I downloaded and saved the setup file while using XP and it is installed on 98SE as long as you browse to it.

The Antec P-160 is a sweet case, as are their power supplies.

[eidenk]

Nice posts lunac.

Just do not too much agree with you about RAM. Unbranded is a bit of a lottery. It may work or it may not. In my own experience, I went back last year four times to the local computer shop to swap unbranded memory bars the dealer was telling me where top quality. Finally he gave me some Samsungs and it all went well. He did not charge me the extra bucks for the Samsungs. But the rebate was not worth the harrassment.

Just my own experience. Now I always ask for Samsungs and so far it always works well.

For HDD I now go only for Western Digital Caviar for some reason. Well I lost a few Maxtors.

[PROBLEMCHYLD]

from what i ve read it seems as if amd is better than intel. if so i'll go with amd,correct me if i'm wrong

[Lunac]

eidenk, I never mentioned anything about "unbranded" RAM. I had a unique chance last year to have a chat with two Mushkin employees and what they told me surprised me quite a bit. (Well I was not that surprised. Micron was fined $84 million dollars for price fixing schemes just a few weeks ago. Samsung was fined $300 million back in 2004 as was Hynix, which was fined $185 million. Google it. News articles all over the place. It's a dirty industry.)

Anyways, they flat out admitted that there wasn't much difference between their value and performance product lines. It all really depended on who they contracted that quarter to supply them with ICs. If they could get a good price from Elixir for several 100k units, then Elixir ICs is what Muskin RAM was going to feature that year. I got a similar story from a Corsair tech. It opened my eyes.

I am not saying go out and buy any RAM. Before I bought my Buffalo kit, I downloaded the white papers on that particular product from Buffalo(Melco) corporate website, as well as contacted their tech support to confirm some specs. Although, I doubt your average consumer will bother to do that. And that's what "quality" brand names such as Mushkin and Corsair are counting on.

Socket A is still a viable platform. No doubt. I prefer nVidia, as I mentioned in another thread, I have owned 3 (now 4) nVidia video cards. Never had any complaints. (I owned GeForce3 Ti 500, GeForce4 MX 420, GeForce4 Ti 4600, and now GeForce 6600GT.)

This post has been edited by Lunac: 14 March 2006 - 06:13 PM

[LLXX]

I'd go with Intel, simply because when 98se was released the dominant processors were Intel and their code is optimised for it. A late-model P4 D should work very well, and aren't subject to quite the same thermal problems that AMDs are known for.

[Lunac]

LLXX, from an economic and budget standpoint, AMD is a sure winner. You can get a decent nForce2 motherboard (rebranded Epox, if they still got them in stock @ Geeks.com) with a socket A Sempron 3300+ CPU (which is really a rare Athlon XP 3200+ Barton CPU intended for asian OEM market), all for $110 with s&h. There is no Intel platform that can beat that performance at that price. No way.

Thermal properties, LLXX? I think TomsHardware started it all. They released a video few years ago that showed what happens to an Intel and AMD CPUs running without any colling. Heatsink or fan. AMD CPU got hot real fast. That video generated lot of publicity. I put that video in the same category as I would a video of a man eating fifteen live chickens. Pure shock entertainment. Didn't seem to harm AMD any, and rightfully so. I mean, who runs their CPU without any cooling? No really, who?

I never owned a AMD CPU until 2003. After purchasing my Athlon XP I was amazed at the performance.

[PROBLEMCHYLD]

I'm going with a Pentium 4
i think they are faster than AMD.

here is the case i ordered
http://store.comptec...xblmicawi3.html

Also what do OEM Processor mean?
GOOD or BAD

Now i need help deciding on a graphics card

ATi or Nvidia

This post has been edited by PROBLEMCHYLD: 19 October 2006 - 02:39 AM

[awergh]

ATi works better with Revolutions Pack Lite

[PROBLEMCHYLD]

awergh, on Oct 19 2006, 02:30 AM, said:

ATi works better with Revolutions Pack Lite

Thanks but what are the best models of
Ati & Nvidia
that you would recommend older models/newer models.
what has the best performance.This is my 1st graphic card
so i want to make a good decision.