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Enable48BitLBA | Break the 137Gb barrier!

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#426
Philco

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Hi,
I just tested new bighdd package aslo with scandisk and defrag are working now :) I use NU2002 anyway but good work.
Tested om 500GB SATA drive with 2x192GB FAT32 partitions


Only for Czech Windows98 with czech version files:
http://windows98.ic....se/bighdd30.exe (372kB classic install- made with iexpress)
or http://windows98.ic....se/bighdd30.zip (_install.bat)

Btw: tested with 500GB MyBook WD and any FAT32 partitions drive (160GB WD)

Thx LLXX, Petr, RayeR and Maximus Decim! :thumbup

Edited by Philco, 20 April 2008 - 02:09 PM.

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czech localization NUSB, BigHDD & UberSkin - homepage czech project: Winpack.org and windows98.ic.cz


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#427
rememberbooks

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Just read all 22 pages of thread, `cuz I know many competent advisors hate it when visitors ask an already-answered question. There were some good clues, but I don't think it's been exactly asked & answered. Hope someone can help.

Background: (I have newer, faster computers with later OS; but Win95 on an old, slow Acer-built IBM Aptiva remains far and away my favorite. Win 95 won't "die" for me until I can't get it to work any more! It's plenty fast for all I do on it; and all my applications are configured exactly as I like them.) Some years back I put a Promise Technology Ultra 100 TX2 ATA controller into my beloved "antique" Win95 computer to use bigger hard drives than it could originally handle (I think the factory limit was 6 GB per drive). First I put in a 60GB and 80GB drive. They worked fine for several years, but recently one began clattering. I scurried out fast to get a single 320 GB WD EIDE HDD to replace both smaller drives. I used Maxtor Maxblast to partition, format, copy files from the old drives, and make new drive bootable. (Doc for the WD utility said it wanted a newer OS.) OS reports partitions as 90, 98, and 120 GB. So far so good.

It seemed to be working perfectly. But I actually only have about 30 GB total data and prograrms, plus whatever the SWAP file uses. Then I ran into warnings on the Internet about drives which seemed to work but corrupted data when the total in all partitions exceeded 137 GB, with other warnings about ScanDisk and Defrag not working if the drive was over 127 GB or so. I found this site while searching for answers, and installed LXXX's modified ESDI_506.PDR (the latest 4.0 one for Win95, not one of the 4.1 versions for Win98). My system continues to boot and run well; but I have not death-tested it by filling up the drive to greater than 137 GB yet.

Meanwhile, Promise Technology has newer drivers and a newer BIOS for download than I was using, even for Win95. (Thanks to Promise Tech!) I downloaded and successfully installed the new drivers and successfully flashed the BIOS to the newest version. If I understand things correctly, doing so has given me 48-bit LBA large hard drive addressing through the combo of the add-on hardware (Ultra 100 TX2 card) and latest drivers and BIOS update. An early post in the thread says that PCI ATA adapters bypass both the computer's BIOS and the Win95 ESDI_506.PDR file.

This leads me to the actual question: Now wottabout LXXX's modified ESDI_506.PDR file? Which of the three following descriptions and advice applies?

(1) I need all the following to safely address big partitions on my antique Acer-built IBM Aptiva: LXXX's patched ESDI_506.PDR file -- plus the PCI ATA card, driver, and new BIOS.

(2) I don't need the patched ESDI_506.PDR file; but it's harmless since all disk activity is now handled by the PCI ATA card, OK to leave LXXX's PDR file installed.

(3) The patched ESDI_506.PDR file could cause conflicts with the PCI ATA set-up; I should remove it and go back to the original M$ version I saved.

(4) Something else?

I have several computers. I use the Win95 one most; but I reserve the newer, faster ones for software that "old faithful" cannot handle, primarily multi-media, Open Office, and a few resource-intensive hogs. This process has led me to realize I also may need to address the control of large hard drives I have running in a Win 98 machines, too! It's got a 200 GB drive which seems to be working, but I hadn't taken any of the steps above to protect it from file corruption above the 137 GB barrier.

My thanks to LXXX, the other participants, and especially anyone who can eliminate the remaining confusion by answering the above!

#428
dencorso

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The answer is (2) :)

(2) I don't need the patched ESDI_506.PDR file; but it's harmless since all disk activity is now handled by the PCI ATA card, OK to leave LXXX's PDR file installed.

But it is more than just harmless, it is playing it safe, for who knows the future? Some day you might decide or be forced to transfer your installation to another hardware, not using the Promise board but the motherboard BIOS instead, so your system is already ready for it.

BTW, welcome to the forum!

#429
Mijzelf

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An early post in the thread says that PCI ATA adapters bypass both the computer's BIOS and the Win95 ESDI_506.PDR file.

That's not true. the adapter card bypasses the BIOS, but only the supplied driver can bypass the windows default driver.

I agree with dencorso. The ESDI_506.PDR driver is in use or not. In the first case you should have the patched version, in the second case it's not used, and harmless.

#430
rememberbooks

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Thank you both. I very much appreciate such prompt response to a topic most would consider "old news." It looks like my "old favorite" machine is again now set to run ... as long as something else doesn't break. It's had quite a few new parts over the years, both to replace and upgrade; but the MOBO is still the original.

I had a little success this morning with the second machine, which is running Win98SE. Its ATA card is a Maxtor-branded Ultra ATA 100, originally sold in a drive bundle, though now controlling a WD disk, set up similar but not identical to the one in my Win95 box. Although this card was built by Promise and the original drivers pack included files from Promise, it was private-label branded. Seagate's got Maxtor now; and although their WEB site still has a support downloads page for both a 48 bit LBA large drive drivers pack and an updated BIOS flashing kit, neither of these files would actually download. Possibly some alternate files direct from Promise would work; and I might have tried them but for the following.

I went to the Wayback Machine (http://web.archive.org/) and pasted in the URL for the page at Seagate's site where they offer the files that didn't (or don't) download (that is, perhaps they would at a less busy time? Don't know). Wayback has several earlier versions from February 2007 to later that year. They all reference the same file versions for both the latest driver and the flash update. I also saved full copies of both download pages, as they contain instructions.

Here's the icing on the cake: Although the Wayback machine does not actually have the missing compressed files, the download pages do preserve the filenames and direct download URLs which were in use in 2007. They both proved to be still valid at Seagate's site! I copied those back into my browser and both BIOS 2.01.0.43 in file U100b43.exe and driver version 2.0.0050.42 in file ATADRVR.exe came right through. So, the Wayback Machine helped me grab what was just beyond reach using plain-vanilla methods. Sometimes the extra step leads to good luck.

This wasn't complex like writing code, but it was a "kinda involved" stepwise procedure for an end-user. Thought this note might help someone coming by later in search of the same sort of solution.

#431
dencorso

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Here's the icing on the cake: Although the Wayback machine does not actually have the missing compressed files, the download pages do preserve the filenames and direct download URLs which were in use in 2007. They both proved to be still valid at Seagate's site! I copied those back into my browser and both BIOS 2.01.0.43 in file U100b43.exe and driver version 2.0.0050.42 in file ATADRVR.exe came right through. So, the Wayback Machine helped me grab what was just beyond reach using plain-vanilla methods. Sometimes the extra step leads to good luck.


Wow! That's a quite nice trick. I've been using the Wayback Machine to get otherwise lost text for a long time, but never thought to try the URLs retrieved in the process, as you just did. Thanks a lot for the idea! You rock! :thumbup

#432
Squeek

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I have only just encountered the 137Gb problem in Win98SE with the acquisition and installation of two large HDDs (one - the boot drive - 250GB PATA and a 320GB SATA). All was well until a massive amount of data collected under WinXP must have spilled past the bounderies and appeared as gibberish in Win98!

Your version of ESDI_506.PDR seemed to offer the solution - but isn't there a "gotcha"? How do you replace an existing v4.10.2226 with a v4.10.2226 if I didn't have a v4.10.2226 in the first place? Isn't this a paradox?

Anyway, reading another thread, it is suggested that removing ESDI_506.PDR will force the system to use the BIOS setting and make the large HDDs accessible at the cost of slowing things down. This works as predicted but with other interesting side effects (which I will address in a response to that thread)!

(This is supposed to be a query to LLXX on page 1!)

Edited by Squeek, 22 May 2008 - 02:41 PM.


#433
dencorso

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[...]
Your version of ESDI_506.PDR seemed to offer the solution - but isn't there a "gotcha"? How do you replace an existing v4.10.2226 with a v4.10.2226 if I didn't have a v4.10.2226 in the first place? Isn't this a paradox?


It's not. Simply add the file to %windir%\SYSTEM\VMM32 and you're set. Do it in Real DOS Mode. And, while you're at it, be sure to add ESDI_506.PDR v. 4.10.2225, because v. 2226 is for IBM laptops only.

(This is supposed to be a query to LLXX on page 1!)


She'll never answer, I'm sorry to tell you, for she's been banned for some time already, and AFAIK has disappeared from known cyberspace. :(

#434
Fredledingue

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First try v. 4.10.2225, then v. 4.10.2222 if you are still in DOS compatibility mode.
(Not every PC supports v. 4.10.2225).

You can do in Windows (then reboot),since you are already in trouble. (Using DOS is required during a fresh Windows98 OS install).

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#435
aqcww

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hi all~ :hello:
my biggest question is that,how to see that the new driver file is working successfully?
and to setup it,just copy the file to the direction "iosubsys" in the real dos mode?
thanks all~

Edited by aqcww, 21 January 2009 - 09:46 PM.

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#436
RetroOS

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hi all~ :hello:
my biggest question is that,how to see that the new driver file is working successfully?
and to setup it,just copy the file to the direction "iosubsys" in the real dos mode?
thanks all~

That's pretty much it.
Copy the updated ESDI_506.PDR to x:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM\IOSUBSYS (x:\WINDOWS is your Windows boot folder, normally C:\WINDOWS).
I don't think the file is locked by Windows, so you can probably copy it in Windows and restart.
Although, as with any file replacement, take a copy of the old one just-in-case!

:o Something to be aware of...
I found out that even though I copied the updated file into IOSUBSYS, Windows was actually loading an older version at run time from C:\WINDOWS\OPTIONS\CABS!!!
I found many drivers that were loading this way. Even some 98SE2ME updated files were actually loading old 98SE official Microsoft files from OPTIONS\CABS instead...
I copied all the newer files over the old ones in OPTIONS\CABS.
I searched the registry and could not find or understand WHY Windows would load some files from OPTIONS\CABS and some from WINDOWS\SYSTEM and sub-folders...

To check, go to Device Manager, Properties on the device - for example Primary IDE Controller, Driver, Driver File Details.
Then look at the path for each file.
If any are loading from a different location, then either update that file, or delete it (with caution!).
I would suggest checking all devices in Device Manager since I found a scattering of wrongly loaded drivers.

EDIT: Weird! I have found some files that are loaded from two different places by two different drivers???
Does this mean that there are two images of the file in memory? - Resource wastage!

Edited by RetroOS, 21 January 2009 - 11:39 PM.

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#437
briton

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hi all~ :hello:
my biggest question is that,how to see that the new driver file is working successfully?
and to setup it,just copy the file to the direction "iosubsys" in the real dos mode?
thanks all~

The important part of that was "in real dos mode". The reason we suggest that you switch the file before Windows starts is that otherwise it is possible for file corruption to occur on the drive because Windows will be seeing the wrong size of drive and possibly write over important files. Therefore do NOT do the change of file from within Windows.

It appears from the subsequent post that there are other reasons, but this is the primary reason - in DOS, the file system will remain intact and safe, whereas in Windows, until you change that file, your file system is in danger of corruption. Just stop Windows loading and go into the DOS prompt to do the switch.

If you want to ensure that Windows installs with the new file, see earlier posts regarding inserting the replacement file into the CAB files on your installation disk.

Hope that helps.

#438
alexh110

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I have a multi-boot configuration, with Win 98 SE and Win XP SP3.
Recently installed a new 160GB HDD, and discovered that some of my Word Documents were not being correctly read in the Win 98 partition.
After a bit of research I discovered this issue with the 128GB limit.

I have installed version 2222 of LLXX's patch, and it seems to have solved the problem; but I'm slightly worried that my data could still be corrupted at some point.

I'm not entirely clear whether the Win 98 issue is to do with the HDD total capacity; or the size of the partitions used? There seems to be conflicting information on this.

I've checked in Device Manager, and the system is correctly loading the new driver from the IOSUBSYS directory.
I can't run Scandisk on the new drive under Win 98, since it says there's not enough memory. Would it be a suitable test if I rebooted to DOS from the Win 98 partition, and ran scandisk under DOS?

Since my system had version 2222 rather than 2225, I obviously never downloaded the latest IDE drivers for Win 98 from Microsoft. I wondered if there's anything in that update that would improve performance on my HDD's; or would I be better off sticking with what I've got?


As I understand it there are two issues with HDD's over 128GB. Firstly the Win 98 problem; but also I need to check that my hardware is 48-bit LBA capable.

I have the following:

AS ROCK K7VT2 Version 2.00 mobo,
with American Megatrends BIOS version P1.20, Firmware Version 101.114, Date 12/10/2002.

plus these HDD's:

Western Digital 40GB, ATAPI-5, CHS: 4865, 255, 63 (System Drive with Win 98 and Win XP partitions)
Seagate 120GB, ATAPI-6, CHS: 19457, 255, 63 (48bit LBA capable)
Maxtor 160GB, ATAPI-7, CHS: 14593, 255, 63 (48bit LBA capable)


According to AS ROCK FAQ's all of their mobos are 48-bit LBA capable, but it's unclear whether this means all their current mobos; or all the mobos they've ever produced?
I would assume it's the latter, and the BIOS does seem to be correctly detecting the Maxtor's capacity.
However this doesn't guarantee that the hardware is 48-bit LBA capable, and I would ideally like to have a cast-iron guarantee that it is!

Edited by alexh110, 02 May 2010 - 06:27 AM.


#439
North of Watford

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Alex,

It seems to me that if WinXP is seeing all the appropriate hardware, then it is sufficiently LBA capable.

LLXX's patch is in daily use on at least three of my PCs, and I have lost no data since installation due to that matter. (I have lost some due to my own carelessness, but that is another matter entirely!)

The limit is per physical disk. One can only avoid it on a larger disk by creating a <137GB partition right at the start of the platter. The same size, but further onto the platter will suffer the data wraparound problem, with the FAT being overwritten by data. It was an error like that which caused me to find out about LLXX's patch, and it has never failed me.

Scandisk works OK for me, but all my partitions are smaller than 120GB. So maybe its limits are partition, not physical disk platter.

Once you have installed the LLXX patch (or R Loew's shareware patch) I'd suggest taking your 160GB drive (assuming it contains nothing irreplaceable at present), and filling it up with backup under Win98. Then re-attaching the drive under WinXP. Open a few files, and make sure that they are real and work properly.

Of course a valid backup is essential before starting on anything like this. But if your LLXX patch installation goes as smoothly as mine, you will never need the backup.

#440
dencorso

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And if you want more info or more answers, sit back, relax, and read this thread *and* all those linked from it.

#441
alexh110

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Thanks very much for the replies.

I've decided not to install BHDD31.ZIP, since this probably assumes that I have version 2225 of ESDI_506, instead of 2222. So I'm concerned it may screw up my system!

Can you give me any more information on the changes Microsoft made between versions 2222 and 2225?

I was hoping someone would have the same mobo as me, so they could confirm that it definitely does support HDD's above 137GB.
It says in the documentation that it supports UDMA Mode 6; but does this imply that it has 48-bit LBA support?
Since my Maxtor HDD is UDMA-7, I wonder whether this is backwards compatible with a UDMA-6 mobo?

#442
submix8c

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MS Ver 2225 fix 32gb Scandisk problem (click it for info)

UDMA-mode is not necessarily "directly" related to 48-bitLBA. It's the BIOS-aware ability to utilize 48-bitLBA (built into the HDD). Usually, backwards compatibility (UDMA-n) is also integral. The MS-fix (link above) is a "patch" for up-to 132gb as long as the BIOS supports it. The modules in the first post "patch" the MS "patch" to allow for 48-bitLBA, which exceeds the MS specification as long as the BIOS supports it.

HTH (am I correct, all?)

(p.s. I use this "patched" version as I have a 250gb-48bit HDD on a 48bit-aware PC)

edit - since it's a very new HDD, it probably is 48-bit; BIOS must support it...
edit2 - and the BHDD31 is a complete package... (re-read the link dencorso provided)

Edited by submix8c, 03 May 2010 - 11:08 AM.

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#443
MDGx

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If any1 cares, I collected all 3 editions of Big HDD tools:
http://www.mdgx.com/add.htm#TLS

* Big Hard Disk Drive (BHDD) 3.1 tools for Windows 95/OSR1/OSR2/98/98 SP1/98 SE: Fixed FORMAT.COM (also installed by FDSKFRMT.EXE), Fixed FDISK.EXE (also installed by FDSKFRMT.EXE), Disk Defragmenter (DEFRAG.EXE 4.90.3000, also installed by SCANFRAG.EXE) + Disk Scanner [SCANDSKW.EXE 4.90.3000 (Windows mode) + SCANDISK.EXE (native DOS mode), also installed by SCANFRAG.EXE] + Improved Hard Disk Driver ESDI_506.PDR 4.10.2230 (Win98 SE only, also installed by ATADRV98.EXE):
- BHDD 3.1 [474 KB, English]:
http://www.mdgx.com/files/BHDD31.ZIP
- BHDD 3.1 [477 KB, French]:
http://www.mdgx.com/files/BHDD31FR.ZIP
- BHDD 3.0 [373 KB, Czech]:
http://www.mdgx.com/files/BHDD30CZ.EXE

HTH




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