[Philco]

Lecco, on Nov 13 2007, 12:14 PM, said:

eidenk, on Nov 13 2007, 03:58 AM, said:

I wonder if the Intel Application Accelerator is not relevant to your system rather than LLXX's but I am not sure of that at all.

Look here. I have a 865PE chipset.

Quote

The Intel® Application Accelerator supports the following Intel® chipsets:

* Intel® 810 Chipset
* Intel® 810E Chipset
* Intel® 810E2 Chipset
* Intel® 810L Chipset
* Intel® 815 Chipset
* Intel® 815E Chipset
* Intel® 815EP Chipset
* Intel® 815G Chipset
* Intel® 815EG Chipset
* Intel® 815P Chipset
* Intel® 820 Chipset
* Intel® 820E Chipset
* Intel® 840 Chipset
* Intel® 845 Chipset
* Intel® 845E Chipset
* Intel® 845G Chipset
* Intel® 845GE Chipset
* Intel® 845GL Chipset
* Intel® 845GV Chipset
* Intel® 845PE Chipset
* Intel® 850 Chipset
* Intel® 850E Chipset
* Intel® 860 Chipset

Note: The Intel Application Accelerator is not compatible with the Intel® 875P, 865G/P/PE, 852/855 GM/GME, 855MP, 848P, 815EM chipset, the Intel® 440 chipset family, or any earlier Intel chipsets. The Intel Application Accelerator is also not compatible with any Intel® 900 series Express Chipset families.

...

Sorry czech lang...

Zkoušel jsi Chipset z Windows98.ic.cz ? Intel chipset INF update 6.3.0.1007 pro novější chipsety 8xx, a neoficiální update od Petra pro 9xx. Úspěšně jsem odzkoušel na i945.

[Lecco]

@ Philco : Díky, pomohlo to aspoň tak, že se už neukazuje modrá obrazovka. Ovšem procesor je teďka vytíženej na 100%, což předtim určitě nebyl. (myslim) Při poslouchání muziky se muzika pořád zasekává... Když to v Totalcopy omezim na 5000KB/s (nejvyšší možná hodnota), tak procesor sem tam klesne k 90%, ale pořád to není to pravé ořechové.

@ all : Philco advised me to install some new Intel INF drivers from his site. It helped a bit, I dont get BSOD now, but during the copying, the CPU is being used on 100%, which wasnt the case before. (I think) The music I listen to during the copying skips a lot. If I limit the speed in Totalcopy to 5000KB/s (highest possible value), the CPU usage drops sometimes to 90%, but still, it isnt the best solution.

[RJARRRPCGP]

Lecco, on Nov 22 2007, 04:20 AM, said:

@ Philco : Díky, pomohlo to aspoň tak, že se už neukazuje modrá obrazovka. Ovšem procesor je teďka vytíženej na 100%, což předtim určitě nebyl. (myslim) Při poslouchání muziky se muzika pořád zasekává... Když to v Totalcopy omezim na 5000KB/s (nejvyšší možná hodnota), tak procesor sem tam klesne k 90%, ale pořád to není to pravé ořechové.

@ all : Philco advised me to install some new Intel INF drivers from his site. It helped a bit, I dont get BSOD now, but during the copying, the CPU is being used on 100%, which wasnt the case before. (I think) The music I listen to during the copying skips a lot. If I limit the speed in Totalcopy to 5000KB/s (highest possible value), the CPU usage drops sometimes to 90%, but still, it isnt the best solution.

Appears to be in PIO mode!

This post has been edited by RJARRRPCGP: 23 November 2007 - 09:04 PM

[Lecco]

HOORAY PROBLEM SOLVED !!!

Do you know, where the problem was? Call me an id***, but in the fresh install of Win98, the DMA mode was not enabled... My original install of Win98 is maybe (definitely ) corrupted, so thats why there was that BSOD issue... As a proof, take a look on the screenshot I made a few minutes ago...

 copy.jpg (16.8K)
Number of downloads: 17

The average copy speed I calculated is 20.854 MB/s (SATA => SATA)

Many thanks to all of YOU !!!

[DaveLH]

Hi!

I found this thread (and this forum) while searching for a solution to the problem I'm having, and hoping you can help:

I recently replaced my system's hard drive after the old one crashed. The new drive is a Seagate PATA 320 GB, and my system was self-built in March, 2002, CPU: AMD Duron, Award BIOS 6.0, Chipset: VIA KT133A. I installed the drive and tried to configure it as my system was before: Dual-booting Windows 98 SE and Windows XP Pro. The 98 partition is 10 GB and the rest of the drive is divided into 50 GB NTFS volumes.

Everything is fine under XP, but the system has been randomly freezing in Windows 98, usually during writes to the
drive, e.g. while copying to the 98 partition from CD or installing drivers. And now, after installing the sound drivers,
Win98 won't finish booting at all -- As soon as the Desktop appears, one of those "snare drum" dialogs appears with
the message "Please wait while updating system settings..." but the system always hangs before this completes -- Total screen freeze and the hard drive light remains steadily on -- Only pressing the Reset button recovers from this.

I have scanned the disk and it's error-free, and as I say, there are no issues with the drive under XP -- I can even read/write to the 98 partition under XP without problems.

Based on the info I've garnered from various sources, I thought everything would be okay as long as the 98 partition was well under the 137 GB limit, even if the BIOS didn't support 48-bit LBA. (As I say, the BIOS is dated from early 2002, which was kind of in the transitional period.) But these system hangs suggest that the BIOS is not liking the large HDD under Win98, and I'm assuming there's no issues under XP because NT-based OSes use HAL rather than the BIOS. But then, why was I able to install Win98 at all?

Anyway, I suppose I could continue to just use XP and regard the 10 GB 98 partition as useless (except for holding the XP bootstrap) until I can afford to build myself an up-to-date system. But there are a couple of legacy apps I use that only run on 98 that I'd like to have access to, so any help/advice anyone here can offer I would greatly appreciate.

Thanks,

Dave

[galahs]

You did install Windows 98 on the first partition (C:) didn't you?

If Win98 is installed on C: drive (formatted to FAT32) and it is less than 137GB there should not be a problem. And since Win98 can't access NTFS you have basically put the rest of the hard disk off limits to the Operating System.

Could be a bad install of Win98 / drivers etc? Maybe you need to re-install Windows 98 again.



You can do that then repair the XP Boot loader with your choice of operating systems



OPTION 1

Quote

# Using the boot disk/CD, boot the system into the Command Prompt with CDROM Support.
# Proceed to install Windows 9x from your CD-ROM drive. Insert the CD into the drive and enter the following commands

1. E: (Changes to your CD-ROM Drive, substitute E for the drive if it is something else)
2. CD\SETUP (Change to your Windows 9x Setup folder, ignore if the SETUP.EXE is in the root folder. Substitute SETUP with the folder name of Win9x if SETUP.EXE exists on a different folder)
3. SETUP (Starts the Win9x installation program)
4. Make sure you choose Custom Install and specify the installation folder as D:\WINDOWS (assuming D is your Win9x partition). Follow the normal installation routine and install Win9x.

FIXING XP's boot loader



This step may not be required. Check to see if there is a menu when you start your computer. If there is, you have successfully installed Windows 98, and a menu has already been created. To make it such that Windows XP boots by default, select the XP Boot option, login into admin account, right click on "My Computer", Properties, Advanced, Startup and Recovery Settings and set the default operating system as Windows XP.

1. You will realise that Windows XP cannot be booted up now. Insert your Windows XP CD and restart your system. You should see a prompt "Press any key to boot from CD.." asking to you press a key to enter Setup. Do so.
2. Choose the Repair option. Never do a complete reinstallation.
3. Select the original drive that Windows XP usually boots to (usually C:)
4. Login as an administrator account
5. At the command prompt, type FIXMBR C:
6. Then type FIXBOOT C:
7. If any confirmation appears, answer yes.
8. Type exit and restart your system.
9. Windows XP would have created a menu for you to choose from booting Windows 98 and XP every time you boot up your PC.

OPTION 2

Quote

1) Create a Win98 Startup Disk

2) Create a Notepad file with the following entries, exactly as shown:

L 100 2 0 1
N C:\BOOTSECT.DOS
R BX
0
R CX
200
W
Q

3) Save the file to the Win98/Me Startup Disk as READ.SCR

4) Boot with the Win98 Startup Disk and at the A: prompt type
DEBUG <READ.SCR

Steps 1 - 4 create the BOOTSECT.DOS file needed to boot Win98. You may need to use the ATTRIB C:\BOOTSECT.DOS -S -H -R command if BOOTSECT.DOS already exists and you get an error when trying to recreate it.

5) Configure your computer to boot from the CD drive. This is done in the BIOS, or your computer may offer the option at startup if it detects a bootable CD. If your computer does not support booting from CD-Rom, you should also be able to boot with a 98 Startup disk, and run WINNT.EXE from the I386 folder of your XP CD.

6) Insert your XP CD and boot from it.

7) You'll see some files being copied, then you'll be presented with a choice of installing or
repairing an existing installation. Choose Repair.

8) You'll be asked which XP installation you want to log into. Enter 1. There is usually only
one installation.

9) You'll be prompted for the Administrator password. For Home, the default password is blank, so just hit Enter. For Pro, enter the same password you did during setup for the Administrator account (this is not the same as the password for an Admin level account. It must be the Administrator account password).

10) At the C:\Windows prompt, type FIXBOOT. You'll be prompted to confirm. Do so.

11) When FIXBOOT is finished, remove the XP CD and type EXIT and the machine will reboot.
Reconfigure your computer to boot from the hard drive if necessary.

You will now get the XP Boot loader with your choice of operating systems

This post has been edited by galahs: 28 November 2007 - 11:01 PM

[Mijzelf]

Quote

If Win98 is installed on C: drive (formatted to FAT32) and it is less than 137GB there should not be a problem.

That's not necessarily true. The 320 GB drive is divided in 1*10GB, and 6*50 GB, I presume. This means that there's a linked list of extended partition tables, which are partly located beyond the 137 GB barrier. At boot W98 is following these links, to see if there are supported partitions in the list. When reading an extended partition table beyond 137GB, it will read (semi) random data, which can cause problems.

I'd suggest to just install LLXX's patch. If it doesn't help it will not hurt either. You can do the patching from XP.

[galahs]

I'd also recommend installing LLXX's patch.


I didn't think DOS or Win98?me could even see the NTFS partitions, so why would it affect it? Its only when data has to be written or read from those sections that a problem occurs.



I used to recommend to clients who needed Windows 98 but could only purchase/or already had larger hard disks, that a way around the problem was to only create partitions up to the 120GB and just leave the rest of the disk un-partitioned. Seemed to work fine.

[Mijzelf]

If everything beyond 128 GB is left blank, it will work fine. It will also work fine when you create one big NTFS partition in the remaining space, since W98 indeed will not touch it.

In this case a problem can rise. DaveLH seems to have 7 partitions. That could be 3 primary and 3 logical, but more likely is 1 or 2 primary and 5 or six logical. I've seen several partition managers which create these logical partitions as a linked list. (Maybe all do so).

The primary partiton table defines a 10 GB partition 1, starting at 0, and an extended partition 2 (which is a partition table itself), starting at 10 GB.
Extended partition 2 defines a 50 GB logical partition 3 starting at 10 GB plus a little, and an extended partition 4, starting at 60 GB plus a little.
Extended partition 4 defines a 50 GB logical partition 5 starting at 60 GB plus a little, and an extended partition 6, starting at 110 GB plus a little.
Extended partition 6 defines a 50 GB logical partition 7 starting at 110 GB plus a little, and an extended partition 8, starting at 160 GB plus a little.
...

W98 has to check all extended partitions, to see if they define a logical FAT partition, but when reading extended partition 8, it will read the data what happens to be at address (160 mod 137) ~ 23 GB. This may or may not look like a partition table. Both cases are bad, and can damage the W98 memory structures.

To safely use an unpatched W98 system on a huge IDE disk, al partitions used by W98 and all partition tables have to be below 137 GB.

This post has been edited by Mijzelf: 30 November 2007 - 07:55 AM

[galahs]

Ah now I understand what your saying.

[rloew]

Even a Patched Windows 9X System is not safe if the BIOS does not support 48-Bit LBA. During Startup, Windows 9X uses DOS and the BIOS to load software and update system files (WININIT). It also uses the BIOS in Safe Mode or Compatability mode. Windows XP and Vista also have to use the BIOS to load their Kernels and Disk Drivers during Startup. This leaves a window of vulnerability in which any Writes to the higher partitions could corrupt data in the lower ones.

Since the damage could be just a few bytes, as occurs when Windows XP tags an extended partition table entry, the damage may not be obvious

Neither LLXX's Patches nor my High Capacity Disk Patch solve this problem. I wrote a separate package called BOOTMAN for my customers to provide an overlay to the BIOS to provide the necessary support.

[briton]

I agree - apply the patch. You might want to wipe the 98 partition and reinstall it afterwards in case.

You are ensuring that you can't access the other partitions when you install Win98, right? One thing you might consider is using a boot manager which can hide everything else when you boot into 98 and ensuring that the other partitions simply don't exist when you install 98 (use Ranish Partition Manager or something similar to "remove" the partitions from the table and put them back after you have installed 98 then change the boot manager settings to ensure they are hidden whenever you boot into 98).

Oh and you aren't using dynamic disks in XP, right?

Hope you sort it out, DaveLH, and please come back and let us know when you do and how you did it!

This post has been edited by briton: 30 November 2007 - 05:49 PM

[briton]

Lecco, on Nov 24 2007, 12:58 PM, said:

As a proof, take a look on the screenshot I made a few minutes ago...

copy.jpg

The average copy speed I calculated is 20.854 MB/s (SATA => SATA)

Way to go Lecco. Glad you found it. But what exactly is that dialog in the screenshot showing us? Sorry to be ignorant, but I can't pick out the clue.

This post has been edited by briton: 30 November 2007 - 05:53 PM

[Lecco]

briton, on Dec 1 2007, 12:52 AM, said:

Lecco, on Nov 24 2007, 12:58 PM, said:

As a proof, take a look on the screenshot I made a few minutes ago...

copy.jpg

The average copy speed I calculated is 20.854 MB/s (SATA => SATA)

Way to go Lecco. Glad you found it. But what exactly is that dialog in the screenshot showing us? Sorry to be ignorant, but I can't pick out the clue.

No, youre not an ignnorant. In the lower left corner, there is the copying speed in kB/s. I thought you are familiar with Totalcopy.

This post has been edited by Lecco: 01 December 2007 - 03:08 AM

[Mijzelf]

Quote

One thing you might consider is using a boot manager which can hide everything else when you boot into 98

That doesn't help. The mechanism used to hide a partition is to set the 'hidden' bit in the partition descriptor. So W98 still has to parse the partitiontables to see if it should ignore the particular partition, which it already does, since W98 ignores all unknown partition types.

[briton]

Mijzelf, on Dec 1 2007, 07:10 AM, said:

Quote

One thing you might consider is using a boot manager which can hide everything else when you boot into 98

That doesn't help. The mechanism used to hide a partition is to set the 'hidden' bit in the partition descriptor. So W98 still has to parse the partitiontables to see if it should ignore the particular partition, which it already does, since W98 ignores all unknown partition types.

OK, but that doesn't apply if you edit the partition table manually and actually DELETE all other partitions except the one on which you are going to install Win98. In that case, the partition table only includes that partition - the rest of the space is seen as unpartitioned EMPTY (or available) space by the Win98 installer and by Win98 when it boots. Once you have successfully installed Win98, you go back to the partition table and manually enter the partition information which was there before you "deleted" them. You don't lose data because the data in the partitions themselves still exists. It was a method by which some RPM users used to have more than 4 primary partitions - they simply deleted the partition table info for the ones they weren't using at the time. Of course, during the time that the partition table information has been deleted, you must NOT use any utilities which will try to use that space and of course you need to have recorded the partition table parameters so that you can put them back in the table.

Just an idea to find out what was going wrong.

[xrayer]

Hi,
I just bought big SATA HDD WD 500GB. I set "IDE/combined" mode in SETUP (chipset: i945G+ICH7R) to operate 2 SATA ports like standard IDE channel (PATA have attached CDW+DVDW, SATA - HDD). I made here 1 FAT16 and 2 FAT32 (192GB) partitions. It's well accessible from DOS 7.1 but I can access only 1st FAT32 from Win98se. So I installed LBA48 patch (~100kB self-installation exe which should replace ESDI_506.PDR)

The problem is a BSOD I got on next boot (translated from CZ):
"Bad call of dynamic connection of VxD ESDI_506.PDR(03) + 000017EB to device 0026 service A. And ask if I want to continue".

When I continue it boot OK and even LBA48 works - I can access all partitions. But I got this nasty BSOD on every startup. Is there some alternative and fully working LBA48 patch?

Another question to SATA - why Win98SE cannot work with IDE/enhanced mode (1 PATA channel + 4 SATA ports?). In DOS 7.1 it works but Win98SE hangs during boot but works in safe mode. It's not too important now I can live with combined mode.

[Lecco]

@ xrayer : I also have a 500GB SATA harddrive from WD a dont get any BSOD. Maybe its the problem wih i945 chipset, I have only i865PE. But I have also the issue with IDE/combined mode (called compatible in my BIOS). I can only use 2 channels - IDE+IDE or IDE+SATA, if I use enhanced mode, Windows hangs during bootup. I dont know where the problem is, but as I replaced my old 120 + 80 GB drives with a 500GB one, I no longer need to think about it.

[xrayer]

Lecco, on Dec 3 2007, 04:45 PM, said:

@ xrayer : I also have a 500GB SATA harddrive from WD a dont get any BSOD. Maybe its the problem wih i945 chipset, I have only i865PE. But I have also the issue with IDE/combined mode (called compatible in my BIOS). I can only use 2 channels - IDE+IDE or IDE+SATA, if I use enhanced mode, Windows hangs during bootup. I dont know where the problem is, but as I replaced my old 120 + 80 GB drives with a 500GB one, I no longer need to think about it.

I don't know exact driver version because I was installing new mobo during weekend and no network working yet and had some ?? ver. So I downloaded latest version from here and try it when back at home. I also readed from other users that enhanced mode doesn't work. BTW I use 2nd PATA HDD with Kouwell IDE/SATA adapter and is seems to be perfectly transparent to the system.

You say you have 865 chipset, then you wouldn't need this patch because of intel application accelerator should provide own LBA48 bit enabled driver for you if you installed it. Maybe it would be possible to patch intel's driver to force it work on ICH7 too.

[Lecco]

xrayer, on Dec 3 2007, 05:03 PM, said:

I don't know exact driver version because I was installing new mobo during weekend and no network working yet and had some ?? ver. So I downloaded latest version from here and try it when back at home. I also readed from other users that enhanced mode doesn't work. BTW I use 2nd PATA HDD with Kouwell IDE/SATA adapter and is seems to be perfectly transparent to the system.

I can send you the INFs I use, just send me a PM with your mail or ICQ. External SATA/PATA controllers do always work.

xrayer, on Dec 3 2007, 05:03 PM, said:

You say you have 865 chipset, then you wouldn't need this patch because of intel application accelerator should provide own LBA48 bit enabled driver for you if you installed it. Maybe it would be possible to patch intel's driver to force it work on ICH7 too.

IAA doesnt work od 856PE chipset, look here.